在俄羅斯汽車市場，印度汽車品牌能擠壓中國汽車品牌市場份額嗎？
Can Indian Brands save Russian car Market from "100%" Chinese Invasion?
譯文簡介
網友：自俄烏戰(zhàn)爭以來，幾乎所有其它國家的汽車品牌（大多數為歐洲汽車品牌）都離開了俄羅斯。這導致了巨大的市場空白，但由于中國是俄羅斯的盟友，中國汽車品牌正以你無法想象的速度占據這個市場。
正文翻譯
Can Indian Brands save Russian car Market from "100%" Chinese Invasion?
在俄羅斯汽車市場，印度汽車品牌能擠壓中國汽車品牌市場份額嗎？
評論翻譯
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2023年10月28日
And that resulted in a huge market void. But as China is a Russian ally Chinese car brands are filling up this market with speed u can't even imagine.
But we all know that India also took a neutral stance against Russia.
自俄烏戰(zhàn)爭以來，幾乎所有其它國家的汽車品牌（大多數為歐洲汽車品牌）都離開了俄羅斯。
這導致了巨大的市場空白，但由于中國是俄羅斯的盟友，中國汽車品牌正以你無法想象的速度占據這個市場。
但我們都知道，印度在針對俄羅斯方面也采取了中立立場。
I think Mahindra and Tata took the best decision for their bottom line. They are capable of breaking into the American and European markets, so it would have been an unwarranted risk.
我認為馬恒達和塔塔做出了最好的決定。他們有能力打入美國和歐洲市場，所以這將是一個不必要的風險。
They aren't yet capable to break into US market european market is just shadow of it. The stringent regulations and hostility towards other brands especially asians is predominant in there Our two brands have miles to go before passing their safety net, our 5star rating is still Global NCAP not the actual NCAP, realistly speaking don't expect any of our vehicle there anytime soon.
他們還沒有能力打入美國市場，歐洲市場只是影子。嚴格的法規(guī)和對其他品牌尤其是對亞洲品牌的敵意在那里占主導地位。我們的兩個汽車品牌距離通過他們的安全網絡還有很長的路要走，我們的五星評級仍然是全球新車評價規(guī)程（Global NCAP），而不是實際的歐洲新車評估測試，實際上，我們的任何車輛都做不到很快進入那個市場。
@SJ_new asian brands are massive in USA. Honda and toyota for example
亞洲品牌在美國很受歡迎，比如本田和豐田。
@SJ_new dude mahindra is huge in usa, even thar based adventure vehicle was the best seller before jeep filed a case against mahindra
老兄，馬恒達在美國的市場份額是很大的，在吉普對馬恒達提起訴訟之前，甚至其探險車也是最暢銷的。
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@Akelehimarenge you are looking through YouTube etc. on the ground, in there average joe has yet to hear name mahindra outside agriculture
你可以在油管等網站上看到，在那里，除了農業(yè)之外，普通人還沒有聽說過馬恒達這個品牌。
I don't think so. Even in European car market Chinese companies sell far more cars than Indian car companies.
我不這么想，即使在歐洲汽車市場，中國汽車公司的銷量也遠遠超過印度汽車公司。
@thecomment9489 only ev's by china in europe not ice cars and that too in low grade parts of europe. china can't compete in with regulations etc. Infact our cars like indica and siera were present in uk etc. decades before china.
在歐洲只有中國制造的電動汽車，而不是內燃機汽車，在歐洲低（消費）檔次地區(qū)也是如此。中國無法在監(jiān)管等方面競爭。事實上，我們的汽車，比如小型轎車印迪卡(Indica)和Sierra ，早在中國幾十年前就在英國等地出現了。
@SJ_new Nonsense propaganda. Yes in ICE technology Chinese carmakers are not that advanced but in EVs their cars are at par with the best in the world and China is also the largest car exporter in the world. BYD cars are becoming common in EU market. Indica, Sierra whatever not so much.
無意義的宣傳，在內燃機技術方面，中國汽車制造商并不是那么先進，但在電動汽車方面，他們的汽車與世界上最好的汽車相比是不相上下的，中國也是世界上最大的汽車出口國。比亞迪汽車在歐盟市場正變得越來越普遍。相反印度的Indica, Sierra之類的就沒那么多了。
You are delusional. Have you seen the recent models of Chinese cars. They are even selling it more and more in middle east. I seriously doubt that Mahindra and Tata can match Chinese in car manufacturing.
你在妄想。你看過中國汽車的最新款式嗎?他們甚至在中東賣得越來越多。我嚴重懷疑馬恒達和塔塔在汽車制造方面能否與中國汽車匹敵。
@RnR1001 He's not only delusional but also propagandistic.
他不僅有妄想癥，而且善于宣傳
@SJ_new It is relatively TRUE , because in U.S TOYOTA is still in no:1 car manufacturer , being an ASIAN BRAND. They only care for reliability .
這是相對正確的，因為作為一個亞洲品牌，豐田在美國仍然是排名第一的汽車制造商。他們只關心可靠性。
@thecomment9489 if you compare with ours the yes china has sold more but still it is in decimals and we aren't present currently there but only reason china could sell just handful of cars is bcoz heavily sponsored by com...st govt. all of their brands are state entities, it is gov.t selling directly not like business brands like ours etc. which have to go through alot different ways. Plus point Chinese have is that people they already have a reputation of not giving quality which makes them easy to sell as no one is expecting anything from them other than just cheap price. And our brands sell alot more behind the scene just not whole cars as in the end company's goal it to earn not to sell cars.
如果你與我們的汽車比銷量的話，中國品牌的汽車銷量是更多，但占比仍然很小，我們目前還沒有出現在那里，但中國能賣出少量汽車的唯一原因是由其政府大力贊助的原因。他們所有的品牌都是國家實體，是政府直接銷售，而不是像我們這樣的商業(yè)品牌，需要經過很多不同的方式去銷售。中國人的另一點是，他們已經有了不在乎質量的名聲，這使得他們很容易銷售，因為除了價格便宜之外，沒有人對它們有任何期望。我們的品牌在非整車銷售的幕后市場有更好的銷量，因為公司的最終目標是賺錢而不是賣車。
Why not make a shadow company to rebadge Mahindra vehicles in russia?
為什么不成立一家影子公司，在俄羅斯為馬恒達汽車重新注冊個商標?
@supremeleader5516 why not give licence to russian company LADA to build our models instead of shadow company
為什么不給俄羅斯LADA公司許可證來制造我們的車型，而是給影子公司許可證。
@SJ_new These are all losers' arguments. Chinese car quality is now among the best in the world. And does it really matter if the cat is black or white if it catches mice? State entity or private entity the point is China grew rapidly and provided very high quality of life to its citizens. And brining in these losers' argument shows who is in decline. Yes West is in decline.
And no most Chinese carmakers are not government or state owned, not sure how it matters.
這些都是失敗者的論點。中國汽車的質量現在是世界上最好的。抓老鼠的貓是黑貓還是白貓真的重要嗎?不管是國家實體還是私人實體，關鍵是中國發(fā)展迅速，為公民提供了非常高質量的生活。把這些失敗者的觀點引入辯論，表明誰在走下坡路，西方確實正在衰落。
而且大多數中國汽車制造商都不是政府或國有的，我不確定這有什么關系。
Bro, this is exaggeration now. Yes tata and mahindra are capable to break in AUSTRALIA and similar country market, but America and EU. Uff, It's all dominated by mercedes, bmw, audi, maserati, honda, toyota, tesla and many more. ??
兄弟，這太夸張了。是的，塔塔和馬恒達有能力打入澳大利亞和類似國家的市場，但美國和歐盟除外。這一切都是由梅賽德斯、寶馬、奧迪、瑪莎拉蒂、本田、豐田、特斯拉等等主導的。
@yashrajsrgm still long way to go ahead but will reach there
還有很長的路要走，但會實現的。
是的，他們需要航空母艦。你賣它們嗎？
@user-wg3kz1ee9h yes we do, how much will you pay? and how many you want ... tell this first and learn to write in eng
是的，我們有呀，你付多少錢?你想要多少?先把這個講下，然后學著用英文寫吧
@thecomment9489 ?? ur the one who is fool here ! ?? we talking about ICE cars which runs on fuel ?? not Ev's we all agree Chinese company's ahead of Indian brands in ev. Cars but not ICE cars?? its Russia dude ?? where fuel so cheap and ultra cold weather best for ICE ENgine cars ?? not Ev's much where Indian brand's like tata who own landrover and mahindra who own peninferina can easily beat Chinese cheap ICE CARS there already so many complains about Chinese cars in Russia?? I have friends there who doing there MBBS there ??
你才是傻瓜!我們說的是靠燃料驅動的內燃機車，不是電動汽車，我們都贊同這個觀點：中國公司在電動汽車方面是領先于印度品牌的。電動汽車領先，但在內燃機汽車方面并沒有領先。這是俄羅斯，伙計，這里燃料非常便宜，天氣又極冷，最適合內燃機車，印度品牌，比如擁有路虎的塔塔和擁有賓尼法利納(Pininfarina）的馬恒達，可以輕松擊敗中國廉價的內燃機汽車，在俄羅斯，對中國汽車的抱怨已經非常多了，我有朋友在那里攻讀臨床醫(yī)學學士。
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@svanimation8969 And yet there are no Indian ICE cars among the top 20 car makers in the world. Chinese didn't really focus on ICE cars but on EVs and already have many EV carmakers already among the topmost in the world. So it's not that the Chinese can't make good ICE cars. It's just that they didn't focus on it much.
然而，在世界前20大汽車制造商中，沒有印度的內燃機汽車。中國并沒有真正專注于內燃機汽車，而是專注于電動汽車，并且已經有許多電動汽車制造商已經躋身世界前列。所以并不是說中國造不出好的內燃機車，只是他們沒有太關注這個問題。
@tanzeelalam18 Price wise is where the competition will be. The Indian cars will have to meet standards but they won't be Tesla-priced. There is room for well-made Indian cars very competitively priced.
價格才是競爭的關鍵。印度的汽車必會須符合標準，但它們不會按照特斯拉的價格定價。做工精良、價格極具競爭力的印度汽車是有發(fā)展空間的。
Ask a question: if india so advanced, why per capita just 2300
問一個問題:如果印度這么先進，為什么人均只有2300
The fear of Western sanctions is what's keeping Indian car companies from expanding to Russia. I'm sure Mahindra & Tata use Western financial institutions even when they do business in non-Western regions like Africa & West Asia.
對西方制裁的擔憂是印度汽車公司不愿向俄羅斯擴張的原因。我確信馬恒達和塔塔即使在非洲和西亞等非西方地區(qū)開展業(yè)務，也會使用西方金融機構。
Tata, Mahindra should make a subsidiary Car Brand which can be used to deal only with Russian market.
塔塔和馬恒達應該建立一個子公司，專攻俄羅斯市場。
Sanctions will apply to Tata and Mahindra because they are associated with the sub brand plus their financial access will be permanently cut off from SWIFT if they did that since both Tata and Mahindra has other brands in other markets their government can easily block Tata’s and Mahindra’s access to other markets.
制裁將適用于塔塔和馬恒達，因為他們與子品牌有關聯(lián)，如果他們這樣做，他們的金融渠道將被永久切斷，因為塔塔和馬恒達在其他市場都有其他品牌，他們的政府可以很容易地阻止塔塔和馬恒達進入其他市場。
@SJ_new Tata owns the commercial brand of Daewoo and Mahindra sold their stake in SsangYong
塔塔擁有大宇的商業(yè)品牌，馬恒達出售了他們在雙龍的股份
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@ashwinbalu they still could use those brand names if they wanted to but guess what they have other plans just two days ago Daewoo has been re-launched in india officially but this time in car batteries, bicycles plus also in electronics like home & kitchen appliances, so it seems there is lot going behind the curtain which we aren't aware of yet. You can see the whole daewoo launching it's in youtube too a more tha half hour log video showcasing all their product lineup.
如果他們愿意，他們仍然可以使用這些品牌，但你猜他們還有其他計劃。就在兩天前，大宇在印度正式重新啟動，但這次是在汽車電池、自行車以及家用和廚房電器等電子產品領域，所以似乎有很多我們還沒有意識到的幕后活動。你可以在油管上看到大宇的整個發(fā)布情況，一個超過半小時的日志視頻展示了他們所有的產品陣容。
Russian market isnt that big. Brazil and the rest of South America (Mexico) will be better markets. The South American drug cartels will love the Mahindra Thar ??.
Also Mahindra is big in Africa and Australia.
俄羅斯市場沒那么大。巴西和南美其他國家(墨西哥)的市場更好。南美販毒集團會喜歡Mahindra Thar這款車的。
此外，馬恒達在非洲和澳大利亞也很受歡迎。
Real reason is the Sanction Regime of USA. Indian cars are highly dependent on US and European component IP. Manufacturing can be anywhere, but the IP is generally US/European.
真正的原因是美國的制裁制度。印度汽車高度依賴美國和歐洲的零部件知識產權。制造業(yè)可以在任何地方，但知識產權通常是美國/歐洲。
Chinese cars have developed a lot and we Indians buy them in Middle East
Especially Haval,Changan,Geely are one of the top notch cars from China
They have less thirsty engines,feature loaded and bigger cars
If they launch in india they may rule the market like in mobile phones
中國汽車發(fā)展很快，我們印度人在中東也買他們的汽車
尤其是哈弗、長安、吉利都是來自中國的頂級汽車之一。
它們的發(fā)動機耗油更少，車型更大。
如果他們在印度上市，他們可能會統(tǒng)治印度市場，就像在手機市場一樣。
Mahindra have business in USA for farm equipment they can face problems their
馬恒達在美國有農業(yè)設備業(yè)務，不過他們可能會遇到問題
Mahindra is already eating a chunk of Market share in South Africa and Australia, and also growing in another 15+ countries
They are the biggest tractor manufacturers and have the largest share in small tractors in USA...
They even sell huge numbers of the same in China
And i dont even need to mention Indian 2 wheeler Manufacturers
馬恒達已經在南非和澳大利亞占據了一大塊市場份額，并且在另外15個國家的市場份額也在增長
他們是美國最大的拖拉機制造商，在小型拖拉機市場占有最大的份額。
他們甚至在中國銷售了大量的同類產品
我甚至不需要提到印度的兩輪車制造商
The key strategy they can use is a middle man version of a company that will sell Indian cars under its own brand. Basically a rebrand of Indian cars.
Indian companies can establish a company and register it in smaller countries like Nepal, Bangladesh or even Bhutan and sell the cars to that brand which would export it to Russia. It will be little expensive but capturing a market worth billions will take some effort
他們可以采用的關鍵策略是，成立一家中間商之類性質的公司，以自己的品牌銷售印度汽車——基本上是印度汽車的品牌重塑。
印度公司可以在尼泊爾、孟加拉國甚至不丹等小國成立公司并注冊，然后將汽車賣給該品牌，再出口到俄羅斯。成本不會太高，但要占領一個價值數十億美元的市場需要付出一些努力。
Don't you think even if they do this, european and American(both govt and people) would know and could be angry,as to why a competitor selling here is also selling in Russia under a different name, they'll think it's double standards
Still I hope there's a way for Indian car manufacturers to sell in the Russian market but just saying there's still a risk if they do this
你不認為即使他們這樣做，歐洲和美國(政府和人民)也會知道并可能會生氣嗎?為什么在這里銷售的競爭對手也在俄羅斯以不同的名字銷售，他們會認為這是雙重標準。
我仍然希望印度汽車制造商有辦法在俄羅斯市場銷售，但如果他們這樣做，仍然存在風險。
I’ve lived in North America since 2005. These people like big, safe and powerful vehicles along with good looks. I don’t think Indian companies have many vehicles fulfilling all the criteria except JLR. So I think we should focus more on capturing Russian and Central Asian markets and worry less of the west.
我從2005年起就住在北美。這些人喜歡大的、安全的、動力強勁的車，還有漂亮的外觀。除了捷豹路虎，我不認為印度公司有很多滿足所有標準的汽車。因此，我認為我們應該把更多精力放在占領俄羅斯和中亞市場上，而不要太擔心西方。
It's not only because of geopolitical reasons but many OEMs, suppliers, components that TATA and Mahindra cars use come from the west. For e.g the infotainment system they use are Harman and Visteon that are american companies. Same with automatic transmission etc.
這不僅是因為地緣政治原因，而且塔塔和馬恒達汽車使用的許多原始設備制造商、供應商和零部件都來自西方。例如，他們使用的信息娛樂系統(tǒng)是哈曼和偉世通這些美國公司，自動變速器等也是如此。
Harman was purchased by Samsung in 2016
哈曼是在2016年被三星收購的
One of Mahindra groups company operates in Russia, and after the war also they did not pulled their hanks back even after the criticism by many forign media houses. So I am sure just after the end of war they will launch their vehicals in Russia. And they are trying to launch since 2019 but then corona came and the plan got postponed.
馬恒達集團的一家公司在俄羅斯經營，戰(zhàn)爭結束后，即使受到許多外國媒體的批評，他們也沒有退縮。所以我確信戰(zhàn)爭結束后，他們會在俄羅斯發(fā)射他們的車輛。他們自2019年以來一直試圖發(fā)射，但后來日冕來了，計劃被推遲了。
China is a fully sovereign country that's why Chinese automakers were able to enter the Russian car market.
中國是一個完全主權的國家，這就是為什么中國汽車制造商能夠進入俄羅斯汽車市場的原因。
Indian car brands can't compete with Chinese makers. The indian auto industry exists because of the Western technical inputs. Besides that if tomorrow the indian govt decides to allow Chinese carmakers into the market they would literally smoke tata and mahindra. Russia will be a level playing field for Chinese and Indian brands. So no question that indian car makers will have a hard time coping with that.
印度汽車品牌無法與中國制造商競爭。印度汽車工業(yè)的存在是因為西方的技術投入。此外，如果明天印度政府決定允許中國汽車制造商進入市場，他們真的會完虐塔塔和馬恒達的。俄羅斯將成為中國和印度品牌的公平競爭環(huán)境。因此，毫無疑問，印度汽車制造商將很難應對這一局面。
Even Chinese company dependent on Western input without western help they can't even make their own engine
即使是依賴西方投入的中國公司，如果沒有西方的幫助，他們甚至無法制造自己的發(fā)動機
One of the reason Russia wants to sell oil to India on Chinese currency yuan payment, is because India is not selling as much as it is buying from Russia thus resulting in skewed balance of payment position if India wants rupee to be most prefered currency for trading India should export more to Russia and what better way than cars and automobiles.
俄羅斯向印度出售石油希望用人民幣結算的原因之一是，印度從俄羅斯購買的石油比出售的要少，因此導致國際收支失衡。如果印度希望盧比成為最受歡迎的貿易貨幣，印度對俄羅斯的出口份額應該變得更多，還有什么比出口汽車和有關汽車產品更好的方式呢？