三體社區(qū)吐槽：拆分汪淼就是個(gè)錯(cuò)誤，史詩(shī)級(jí)的視野和規(guī)模被網(wǎng)飛的牛津五人組指數(shù)級(jí)縮小了
The Oxford 5 reduced the scope
譯文簡(jiǎn)介
明明是來(lái)自不同背景的人組成的聯(lián)合力量，網(wǎng)飛這版改編卻給人以一小撮人拯救了世界的觀感
正文翻譯
The trisolarian crisis is a global issue. Most of the protagonists hadn't known eachother before yet they were involved in coping with this crisis in some way.
There were nanotech scientist, former cops, soldiers, hedonistic teacher, aerospace engineer, cancer patient, president of a socialism country, former US secretary of defense, Nobel winning scientist. They were born in 1950s, 1980s, Era of Deterrence.
三體危機(jī)是全球性問(wèn)題。大部分主人公之前并不相識(shí)，但他們都以某種方式參與應(yīng)對(duì)了這場(chǎng)危機(jī)。
他們中有納米科學(xué)家、前警員、士兵、耽于享樂(lè)的教師、航天工程師、癌癥患者、某社會(huì)主義國(guó)家的總統(tǒng)、前美國(guó)國(guó)防部長(zhǎng)、諾貝爾獎(jiǎng)得主。他們出生在二十世紀(jì)五十年代、八十年代和威懾時(shí)代。
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Perhaps they even never met eachother in their whole life. But their lives have been connected by the string of the destiny of humanity since the crisis. I feel it like so many people are in the same community for humanity. They have the same target.
很可能，他們之間一輩子都沒(méi)有見(jiàn)過(guò)面。但自危機(jī)發(fā)生以來(lái)，他們的生活就被人類命運(yùn)之弦連在了一起。我感覺(jué)有太多的人都身處同一個(gè)人類共同體。他們目標(biāo)一致。
很可能，他們之間一輩子都沒(méi)有見(jiàn)過(guò)面。但自危機(jī)發(fā)生以來(lái)，他們的生活就被人類命運(yùn)之弦連在了一起。我感覺(jué)有太多的人都身處同一個(gè)人類共同體。他們目標(biāo)一致。
But the Netflix adaption made the joint force of different people from different backgrounds look like the world saved by a small group of people. Operation Guzheng was brought up by Wade and Raj, relying on the technology from one of the Oxford 5. Staircase Project was put forward by Wade and one of the Oxford 5, too. And guess what, wallfacer, swordholder, escapist, spy are all from the Oxford 5. And AA is actually from the future, they are gonna make her Auggie from the Oxford 5. Looks like the Oxford 5 is the center of universe.
明明是來(lái)自不同背景的人組成的聯(lián)合力量，網(wǎng)飛這版改編卻給人以一小撮人拯救了世界的觀感。古箏行動(dòng)由維德和拉杰提出，靠的是牛津五人組其中一位的技術(shù)。階梯計(jì)劃也是由維德和牛津五人組之一提出的。你猜怎么著，面壁人、執(zhí)劍人、逃亡主義者、間諜全都來(lái)自牛津五人組。而艾AA其實(shí)來(lái)自未來(lái)，他們打算讓她成為牛津五人組中的奧吉。看來(lái)牛津五人組才是宇宙的中心。
明明是來(lái)自不同背景的人組成的聯(lián)合力量，網(wǎng)飛這版改編卻給人以一小撮人拯救了世界的觀感。古箏行動(dòng)由維德和拉杰提出，靠的是牛津五人組其中一位的技術(shù)。階梯計(jì)劃也是由維德和牛津五人組之一提出的。你猜怎么著，面壁人、執(zhí)劍人、逃亡主義者、間諜全都來(lái)自牛津五人組。而艾AA其實(shí)來(lái)自未來(lái)，他們打算讓她成為牛津五人組中的奧吉。看來(lái)牛津五人組才是宇宙的中心。
The diversity is limited in the UK, or more specifically, in London(or a little bit in China and US). The epic scope of the book is thus reduced exponentially.
這種多樣性僅限于英國(guó)，更準(zhǔn)確地說(shuō)，僅限于倫敦（在中國(guó)和美國(guó)也有一小點(diǎn)）。這樣一來(lái)，本書(shū)的史詩(shī)級(jí)視野就指數(shù)級(jí)縮小了。
這種多樣性僅限于英國(guó)，更準(zhǔn)確地說(shuō)，僅限于倫敦（在中國(guó)和美國(guó)也有一小點(diǎn)）。這樣一來(lái)，本書(shū)的史詩(shī)級(jí)視野就指數(shù)級(jí)縮小了。
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One of my favorite tropes in wide-scope stories (like Game of Thrones) is having that large cast that doesn't know eachother but POVs start to converge and characters form unlikely connections. I assumed that's what would happen here, and the Oxford Five would be a name for disconnected people-of-interest designated by powers that be like Wade, but no, its just their school club
在各種規(guī)模極大的故事（比如《權(quán)力的游戲》）中，我最喜歡的一個(gè)套路就是，有一大群互不認(rèn)識(shí)的角色，但他們的（主觀）視點(diǎn)開(kāi)始交匯，人物之間形成了虛幻的聯(lián)系。我本以為這個(gè)劇也會(huì)是這種情況，牛津五人組本會(huì)是由維德那樣的當(dāng)權(quán)者定名的互不相識(shí)的利益攸關(guān)者的名字，結(jié)果不是，就只是他們那個(gè)校園俱樂(lè)部。
他們以某種方式“全球化”了這部劇，方法卻是把它變得比書(shū)中更不全球化。
↘那他們就不應(yīng)該把第二和第三本書(shū)中的事件壓縮到這一季里，這一季本就是用來(lái)改編第一本書(shū)的。這樣，他們就有3集的時(shí)長(zhǎng)來(lái)充實(shí)第一部，而不是為了去改編下一個(gè)大事件，匆匆忙忙改編完第一部。
literally had the exact same thought independent of this post. Every character in the book had their own independent network with depth most of which never interacted. It felt like an anime where a group of friends are going off to save the world.
在沒(méi)受本貼影響的情況下，我也產(chǎn)生過(guò)完全一樣的想法。書(shū)中每個(gè)角色都有自己獨(dú)立的縱深網(wǎng)絡(luò)，其中大部分都沒(méi)有產(chǎn)生互動(dòng)。這劇感覺(jué)就像是一伙朋友動(dòng)身去拯救世界的動(dòng)畫(huà)片。
↘被他們拍成了《怪奇物語(yǔ)》。
↘我明白你的意思，也同意你的觀點(diǎn)，但再說(shuō)一遍，8集太有限了。再加上一個(gè)跨越億萬(wàn)年、億萬(wàn)顆星球等的故事，外加大量重要的情節(jié)點(diǎn)、政治和理論，我認(rèn)為，簡(jiǎn)化角色和既定關(guān)系可能會(huì)在整體上帶來(lái)幫助。
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If so, ok stick with 8 episodes if you want them.done well BUT why adapt 1.5 novels of notoriously dense material?WTF?
↘我尋思，他們不就是拿到一筆預(yù)算，然后根據(jù)預(yù)算來(lái)決定集數(shù)的嗎？
如果是這樣，那好，那你們就堅(jiān)持搞8集，如果這就是你們想要的。做得很好，但為什么要改編一部半以素材極為密集出名的小說(shuō)呢？是在搞什么鬼？
↘同意。我為了試著讓自己擺脫偏見(jiàn)，正在重看，但是真該死。我禁不住感覺(jué)他們?cè)谂倪@部劇時(shí)，拿到的是最低限度的預(yù)算。
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Totally agree. I admired superheroes when I was a child. But now, when I look at these frivolous so-called "genius" saving the world, it is disrespectful to the human beings, who are building the world with their "ordinary" efforts. Oxford 5 are too cheesy.
完全同意。我小時(shí)候很崇拜超級(jí)英雄。但現(xiàn)在，當(dāng)我看到這些輕浮的所謂的“天才”在拯救世界，感覺(jué)這是對(duì)那些用“平凡”的努力建設(shè)世界之人的不尊重。牛津五人組太惡俗了。
↘饒有趣味的是，超級(jí)英雄電影通常會(huì)先讓超級(jí)英雄們的故事獨(dú)立發(fā)展，然后再匯聚到一起。如果鋼鐵俠、美國(guó)隊(duì)長(zhǎng)和綠巨人早就是好哥們，那么《復(fù)仇者聯(lián)盟1》就會(huì)少掉一半的樂(lè)趣。
I literally can barely remember their names. Splitting Wang was a mistake.
↘你的意思是，肥胖粗俗的零食男、蠢貨女、舔狗男、自我中心的毒蟲(chóng)和冰美人并不是令人信服的角色？
不夸張地說(shuō)，我都快記不住他們的名字了。把汪淼拆分就是個(gè)錯(cuò)誤。
Just binged it and this was my biggest problem. So you're telling me that the only people who can: come up with the propulsion method, the nanofiber tech, provide a brain, be a wallfacer all just happen to be friends?
Oh and btw the person who invited the aliens in the first place just happened to be the mother of one of their research colleagues.
我剛還搜索了一下，這是我意見(jiàn)最大的點(diǎn)。所以你是在告訴我說(shuō)，唯一能想出推進(jìn)方法、納米纖維技術(shù)、提供大腦、成為面壁人的人恰好都是朋友？
順便說(shuō)一句，當(dāng)初把外星人邀請(qǐng)來(lái)的人，恰好是他們一位研究員同事的母親。
別逗我了，地球上可是有幾十億人呢，這也太荒唐了！
↘我認(rèn)為，這樣做甚至也有違將故事“西方化”的初衷。他們沒(méi)有把故事主體設(shè)定在中國(guó)，也沒(méi)有以中國(guó)角色為主，而是選擇把故事主體設(shè)定在英國(guó)，角色則是隨機(jī)的一群人，還互相認(rèn)識(shí)。這確實(shí)拉低了這個(gè)故事以可信之方式向前發(fā)展的視野/規(guī)模。
↘“我的其中一個(gè)男友可能會(huì)拯救人類”什么的
↘還有一處不滿，我希望大史能更風(fēng)趣些。騰訊那版就好得多了。我認(rèn)為該劇的選角非常完美，但實(shí)在是沒(méi)有給本尼迪克特·王足夠的戲份去發(fā)揮。
In the books the 3 protagonists come from a country with over a billion people. In the show the 3 protagonists were all in the same study group. Which is more ridiculous?
在三本書(shū)中，三位主角來(lái)自一個(gè)擁有十多億人口的國(guó)家。而在本劇中，有三位主角來(lái)自同一個(gè)學(xué)習(xí)小組。哪個(gè)更荒謬？
I think when you are adapting these books to video format you have some obvious problems. When we read the internal thoughts of a character, how is that presented in screen? By making these characters interact with each other and verbalizing their thoughts you can further the story more efficiently. I think this is much better for storytelling then making it more realistic.
我認(rèn)為，當(dāng)你把這些書(shū)改編成視頻時(shí)，你會(huì)碰到一些顯而易見(jiàn)的問(wèn)題。當(dāng)我們讀到一個(gè)人物的內(nèi)心想法時(shí)，要如何在屏幕上呈現(xiàn)出來(lái)？方法就是讓這些角色互動(dòng)起來(lái)，用言語(yǔ)表述他們的想法，這樣就能更高效地推進(jìn)故事。我認(rèn)為在講故事方面，這種做法要比處理得更寫(xiě)實(shí)好得多。
這就和那些很火的罪案劇中似乎總是在抓連環(huán)殺手差不多是一樣的，盡管在現(xiàn)實(shí)生活中，警察靠著出色的工作也很少能抓到連環(huán)殺手。
↘中國(guó)那版成功地通過(guò)動(dòng)作、情感、字里行間的隱含意等來(lái)表達(dá)人物。而不是靠嘴來(lái)表達(dá)一切。
In the books it looked like Trisolarians vs Earth, in this it looks more like Trisolarians vs Wade
在書(shū)中，看起來(lái)像是三體人與地球人的對(duì)決，而在這部劇中，看起來(lái)更像是三體人與維德的對(duì)決。
They seem incapable of breaking free from the 'lone (group of) hero' archetype, don't they?
I'm beyond weary of these hackneyed tropes.
他們似乎無(wú)力擺脫這種“孤獨(dú)的（一伙）英雄”的人物創(chuàng)作模型，不是嗎？
我已經(jīng)厭倦了這些陳腐的套路。
One of the coolest things in the book is when Beihai decided to kill the Ultimate Law then realized the (until that point) unnamed captain figured out the problem independently and did it earlier and better. That is the scale of this book is about: ultimately, the whole world is in this together and everyone is going through the deep thinking.
原著中最酷的事情之一就是，當(dāng)時(shí)章北海決定消滅終極規(guī)律號(hào)，隨后就意識(shí)到（在那之前）有某個(gè)不知名的艦長(zhǎng)靠自己找到了答案，而且出手更早、更準(zhǔn)。這就是本書(shū)的視野所向：最終，整個(gè)世界在一起渡劫，每個(gè)人都在經(jīng)歷深沉的思考。
It's the pinnacle of Netflix faux-diversity. Take a non-western piece of media, change all the characters to hot young people, but it's fine because they're all different skin colors and sexual orientations.
It's sadly ironic how homogenous Netflix's "diversity" is.
這是網(wǎng)飛偽多樣性的巔峰。拿來(lái)一個(gè)非西方的媒體作品，把所有角色都換成熱辣的年輕人，但因?yàn)樗麄兊哪w色和性取向都不一樣，這么干也就沒(méi)問(wèn)題了。
悲哀啊，諷刺的是，網(wǎng)飛的“多樣性”是如此同質(zhì)化。
↘對(duì)于進(jìn)步人士來(lái)說(shuō)，多樣性就是白人男性、黑人男性、女性，沒(méi)有東亞男性，除非他們是胖子/女里女氣/同性戀，基本上是個(gè)閹人。
So far I am in episode 4, I feel the storyline was rushed too fast, as a result, there is less suspence. Some book plots were ommitted which was very unfortunate, for example why on earth change the plot of Ye wenjie murdering her husband ? And in the novle, when Ye met Evans, they were two broken soul who found conformt with each other, why change that? And why omit Evans childhood story ?
目前我看到第四集，我感覺(jué)故事情節(jié)推進(jìn)得太快了，因此懸念也少了。還省略了書(shū)中的有些情節(jié)，這也太遺憾了，比如葉文潔殺害丈夫的情節(jié)，到底為什么要改掉呢？而且在小說(shuō)中，當(dāng)葉文潔遇到伊文斯時(shí)，他們這兩個(gè)破碎的靈魂在對(duì)方那里找到了慰藉，為什么要改動(dòng)這些？為什么要省略伊文斯童年的故事？
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Yes! I've been saying this to almost every post. Everything had a reduced scope. Even the defence was mostly just Wade & Clarence. Where is the committee? Where is the fun interaction where US gets as allies with China. The book tries to show that the entire globe is affected. The series feels like it takes place in 2 cities and has only 20 people involved. It feels cheap. Even the raid had like 4 swats.. That operation should've had hundreds of people involved (by that moment everyone was an ally) Also the UN and wallfacer announcement is on fast forward. Need some intro... Isn't that the prime minister? Or the queen? Give it a grander scale, that announcement is a world wide event. There were just a bunch of people involved. You don't get to feel that everyone is on board on a global scale. Last one the nukes. It was literally a one liner that they just got 300...wtf, go a bit geopolitical, even it's just adding some dialogue ("Russia doesn't agree on such a big concentration of nukes. They barely agreed to sign off on a plan for 200. And later on.. the prime minister of India & president of China manage to run some inteterference, so we managed to get it up to 300. I'm sorry but that's the best we can do").
是的！我在幾乎每個(gè)帖子里都這么說(shuō)。一切都被縮小了范圍。就連（行星）防御也只剩下維德和克拉倫斯。委員會(huì)怎么不見(jiàn)了？美國(guó)和中國(guó)結(jié)盟帶來(lái)的有趣互動(dòng)又在哪里？原著試圖展示全球都受到了影響。而該劇給人的感覺(jué)像是，只發(fā)生在兩個(gè)城市，只有二十個(gè)人參與其中。就感覺(jué)很廉價(jià)。就連突襲行動(dòng)也只有四名特警。那次行動(dòng)本該有數(shù)百人參與（在那一刻，每個(gè)人都是盟友），聯(lián)合國(guó)和面壁人的宣布也是快進(jìn)的。需要一些介紹...那不是首相嗎？還是女王？把視野范圍擴(kuò)大點(diǎn)吧，這次宣布可是世界性的事件。卻只有一群人參與。
你無(wú)法感覺(jué)到每個(gè)人都在全球的層面上同舟共濟(jì)。最后是核武器。簡(jiǎn)直是一句話就搞定了，說(shuō)他們剛剛得到了300 枚...搞什么鬼，來(lái)點(diǎn)地緣政治吧，哪怕只是增加一些對(duì)話（“俄羅斯不同意如此大規(guī)模地聚集核彈。他們勉強(qiáng)同意批準(zhǔn)200枚核彈的計(jì)劃。后來(lái)...印度總理和中國(guó)設(shè)法作了一些干預(yù)，于是我們成功地將核彈數(shù)量提高到了300枚。我很抱歉，但我們已經(jīng)盡力了”）。
The reason is for dramatic impact. If these people didn't all know each other, they either wouldn't be interacting, or would be interacting as strangers. What you're complaining about isn't a consequence of changing the national origins of the characters, it's about wanting an ensemble show, a cast who will relate to each other and have a history together to show and build on, rather than a cast of characters who are all essentially monads.
原因在于戲劇效果。如果這些人互相不認(rèn)識(shí)，他們要么不會(huì)互動(dòng)，要么會(huì)像陌生人一樣互動(dòng)。你抱怨的并不是改變角色國(guó)籍產(chǎn)生的后果，而是想要一個(gè)群像劇，一組能相互關(guān)聯(lián)、有可以展示和進(jìn)一步發(fā)展的共同歷史的演員陣容，而不是一組本質(zhì)上都是單細(xì)胞生物的演員陣容。
原創(chuàng)翻譯：龍騰網(wǎng) http://www.top-shui.cn 轉(zhuǎn)載請(qǐng)注明出處
typical, now I suspect the scxt was written ttem by AI
常見(jiàn)伎倆，現(xiàn)在我都懷疑那劇本都是AI寫(xiě)的。