中國人和韓國就泡菜屬于哪個國家爭吵了許多年，這是有人在故意激起兩國的民族矛盾嗎？
The Chinese and some overseas Chinese continue to say that Chinese introduced kimchi to Koreans. How will Koreans react if anger condenses and explodes this time?
譯文簡介
網(wǎng)友：中韓兩國關(guān)于（泡菜）食物的文化之爭其實非?？尚Γ@種爭論完全來自于早期的誤解+民族主義者的刻意夸大+媒體的刻意炒作。
正文翻譯
Profile photo for Aya Shawn
Aya Shawn
Living in Singapore, professional investorUpvoted by
Mario Steinitz
, lives in China (2010-present)Sun
I am a Singaporean
I'm not Chinese or Korean
But I know both countries very well
The cultural controversy between China and South Korea over (Pickle/Kimchi) food is actually very ridiculous. This controversy comes entirely from early misunderstandings + deliberate exaggeration by nationalists + deliberate hype by the media.
In fact, although Pickle and Kimchi are both traditional pickling techniques for vegetables, they are completely different things.
我是新加坡人
我不是中國人也不是韓國人
但我對這兩個國家都很了解
中韓兩國關(guān)于（泡菜）食物的文化之爭其實非?？尚?，這種爭論完全來自于早期的誤解+民族主義者的刻意夸大+媒體的刻意炒作。
其實，Paocai與Kimchi雖然都是傳統(tǒng)的蔬菜腌制技術(shù)，但卻是完全不同的東西。
Pickle is a traditional food from Sichuan, China. Its principle is to soak vegetables in high-concentration salt water full of yeast and produce a food through natural fermentation. The Chinese call it "Paocai"
This food has two key characteristics:
1. The material is completely immersed in salt water
2. It doesn’t require any condiments except salt,Its unique taste comes from natural substances produced by fermentation
Paocai是中國四川的傳統(tǒng)食品，其原理是將蔬菜浸泡在高濃度的鹽水中，加入酵母，經(jīng)過自然發(fā)酵制成的食品，中國人稱之為“泡菜”
這種食物有兩個主要特點：
1. 將材料完全浸入鹽水中
2. 除了鹽以外不需要任何調(diào)味品，其獨特的味道來自于發(fā)酵產(chǎn)生的天然物質(zhì)
This food has two key characteristics:
1. The material is completely immersed in salt water
2. It doesn’t require any condiments except salt,Its unique taste comes from natural substances produced by fermentation
Paocai是中國四川的傳統(tǒng)食品，其原理是將蔬菜浸泡在高濃度的鹽水中，加入酵母，經(jīng)過自然發(fā)酵制成的食品，中國人稱之為“泡菜”
這種食物有兩個主要特點：
1. 將材料完全浸入鹽水中
2. 除了鹽以外不需要任何調(diào)味品，其獨特的味道來自于發(fā)酵產(chǎn)生的天然物質(zhì)
Kimchi is a traditional food from the Korean peninsula. It ferments vegetables in a container and adds condiments such as chili pepper and shrimp paste. Food produced through natural fermentation.
This food has two key characteristics:
1. The ingredients are not soaked in salt water, but a large amount of salt is added to the ingredients.
2. It requires a variety of condiments including shrimp paste and chili
It's actually more like the "pickled vegetables" popular in other parts of China, but with slightly different seasonings Typical Kimchi always puts some seafood in it for seasoning, which the Chinese never do.
Looking at these two photos, would you think they are the same thing? The difference between them is like hamburger and pizza. The only connection between them is that they both need an oven all use flour
Kimchi是朝鮮半島的傳統(tǒng)食品，將蔬菜放入容器內(nèi)發(fā)酵，再加入辣椒、蝦醬等調(diào)味品，通過自然發(fā)酵制成的食品。
這種食物有兩個主要特點：
1.食材不是浸泡在鹽水里，而是在食材里加入大量的鹽。
2.需要多種調(diào)味品，包括蝦醬和辣椒
它其實更像中國其他一些地方流行的“腌菜”，只是調(diào)味品不同，典型的Kimchi總是將一些海產(chǎn)品放入其中調(diào)味，而中國人從不這么做。
看照片的區(qū)別，你會覺得Paocai與Kimchi是同一種東西嗎？它們之間的區(qū)別就像漢堡和披薩，它們之間唯一的聯(lián)系就是都需要烤箱，都使用面粉。
This food has two key characteristics:
1. The ingredients are not soaked in salt water, but a large amount of salt is added to the ingredients.
2. It requires a variety of condiments including shrimp paste and chili
It's actually more like the "pickled vegetables" popular in other parts of China, but with slightly different seasonings Typical Kimchi always puts some seafood in it for seasoning, which the Chinese never do.
Looking at these two photos, would you think they are the same thing? The difference between them is like hamburger and pizza. The only connection between them is that they both need an oven all use flour
Kimchi是朝鮮半島的傳統(tǒng)食品，將蔬菜放入容器內(nèi)發(fā)酵，再加入辣椒、蝦醬等調(diào)味品，通過自然發(fā)酵制成的食品。
這種食物有兩個主要特點：
1.食材不是浸泡在鹽水里，而是在食材里加入大量的鹽。
2.需要多種調(diào)味品，包括蝦醬和辣椒
它其實更像中國其他一些地方流行的“腌菜”，只是調(diào)味品不同，典型的Kimchi總是將一些海產(chǎn)品放入其中調(diào)味，而中國人從不這么做。
看照片的區(qū)別，你會覺得Paocai與Kimchi是同一種東西嗎？它們之間的區(qū)別就像漢堡和披薩，它們之間唯一的聯(lián)系就是都需要烤箱，都使用面粉。
--------------------------
This translation problem first came from the Koreans (an ethnic minority in China) living in Liaoning Province, China, who began making such food hundreds of years ago.
In their own language, this kind of thing is called Kimchi. When they entertain Han friends, for the convenience of understanding, they call it "Korean Paocai"
But this title is often simplified, and in the end only Paocai remains This is confused with Paocai from the Sichuan region of China.
On top of this error caused by language translation, some nationalists have found the ground to play.
Koreans: Welcome to try our Kimchi
Chinese: What is Kimchi?
Translator: Ah, it’s Paocai
Chinese: What? Isn’t Paocai Chinese?
Korean: Why Chinese? It's obviously Korean
in turn:
Chinese: Korean friends are welcome to taste our Paocai
Korean: What is Paocai?
Translator: Ah, it’s Kimchi
Korean: What? Isn't Kimchi from Korea?
Chinese: Why Korean? It's obviously Chinese
這個翻譯問題最早來自居住在中國遼寧省的朝鮮族（中國少數(shù)民族），他們幾百年前就開始制作這種食物。
在他們自己的語言里，這種東西叫Kimchi。在招待漢族朋友的時候，為了方便理解，就叫它“朝鮮泡菜”
但這一名稱經(jīng)常被簡化，最后只剩下“泡菜”，這與中國四川地區(qū)的泡菜相混淆。
除了這種語言翻譯造成的錯誤之外，一些民族主義者也找到了施展拳腳的平臺。
韓國人：歡迎品嘗我們的Kimchi
中國人：什么是Kimchi？
翻譯者：啊，是泡菜
中國人：什么？泡菜不是中國人嗎？
韓國人：為什么是中國人的？明明是韓國人的
反過來：
中國人：歡迎韓國朋友品嘗我們的泡菜
韓國人：什么是Paocai？
翻譯者：啊，就是Kimchi
韓國人：啥？Kimchi不是韓國的嗎？
中國人：為什么是韓國的？明明是中國的
This translation problem first came from the Koreans (an ethnic minority in China) living in Liaoning Province, China, who began making such food hundreds of years ago.
In their own language, this kind of thing is called Kimchi. When they entertain Han friends, for the convenience of understanding, they call it "Korean Paocai"
But this title is often simplified, and in the end only Paocai remains This is confused with Paocai from the Sichuan region of China.
On top of this error caused by language translation, some nationalists have found the ground to play.
Koreans: Welcome to try our Kimchi
Chinese: What is Kimchi?
Translator: Ah, it’s Paocai
Chinese: What? Isn’t Paocai Chinese?
Korean: Why Chinese? It's obviously Korean
in turn:
Chinese: Korean friends are welcome to taste our Paocai
Korean: What is Paocai?
Translator: Ah, it’s Kimchi
Korean: What? Isn't Kimchi from Korea?
Chinese: Why Korean? It's obviously Chinese
這個翻譯問題最早來自居住在中國遼寧省的朝鮮族（中國少數(shù)民族），他們幾百年前就開始制作這種食物。
在他們自己的語言里，這種東西叫Kimchi。在招待漢族朋友的時候，為了方便理解，就叫它“朝鮮泡菜”
但這一名稱經(jīng)常被簡化，最后只剩下“泡菜”，這與中國四川地區(qū)的泡菜相混淆。
除了這種語言翻譯造成的錯誤之外，一些民族主義者也找到了施展拳腳的平臺。
韓國人：歡迎品嘗我們的Kimchi
中國人：什么是Kimchi？
翻譯者：啊，是泡菜
中國人：什么？泡菜不是中國人嗎？
韓國人：為什么是中國人的？明明是韓國人的
反過來：
中國人：歡迎韓國朋友品嘗我們的泡菜
韓國人：什么是Paocai？
翻譯者：啊，就是Kimchi
韓國人：啥？Kimchi不是韓國的嗎？
中國人：為什么是韓國的？明明是中國的
In order to apply for cultural heritage, in 2013, the Korean government changed the Chinese translation of Kimchi to "xinqi", but everyone was accustomed to the original translation.
Kimchi is a very important part of life for Koreans, and making kimchi every year is an important cultural event for every Korean family. Kimchi is the highlight of the dinner table for Koreans.
But for Chinese people, pickles are not a very important thing. Although I have seen many restaurants in China still offering simple pickles, they are definitely not the protagonist. In my experience, except for some Chinese friends in Sichuan, Most Chinese families don’t know how to make kimchi themselves.
This kind of quarrel is actually worthless
But nationalists and some media in the two countries rely on such topics to gain good attention, allowing this kind of quarrel to continue year after year.
為了申請文化遺產(chǎn)，2013年，韓國政府將Kimchi的中文翻譯改為了“辛奇”，但大家已經(jīng)習(xí)慣了原來的翻譯。
對韓國人來說Kimchi是生活中非常重要的組成部分，每年制作Kimchi對每個韓國家庭來說都是重要的文化活動。Kimchi對韓國人來說是餐桌上的重點。
但是對中國人來說，Paocai并不是什么很重要的東西，雖然我在中國許多餐廳看到依然提供簡易的Paocai，但那絕對不是主角，在我的經(jīng)驗里，除了一些位于四川的中國朋友，大部分中國家庭也不會自己制作Paocai。
這種爭吵在第三方看來其實毫無價值
但兩國的民族主義者和一些媒體都借此獲得了良好的關(guān)注，他們故意混淆Paocai和Kimchi，使得這種爭吵年復(fù)一年地持續(xù)下去。
Kimchi is a very important part of life for Koreans, and making kimchi every year is an important cultural event for every Korean family. Kimchi is the highlight of the dinner table for Koreans.
But for Chinese people, pickles are not a very important thing. Although I have seen many restaurants in China still offering simple pickles, they are definitely not the protagonist. In my experience, except for some Chinese friends in Sichuan, Most Chinese families don’t know how to make kimchi themselves.
This kind of quarrel is actually worthless
But nationalists and some media in the two countries rely on such topics to gain good attention, allowing this kind of quarrel to continue year after year.
為了申請文化遺產(chǎn)，2013年，韓國政府將Kimchi的中文翻譯改為了“辛奇”，但大家已經(jīng)習(xí)慣了原來的翻譯。
對韓國人來說Kimchi是生活中非常重要的組成部分，每年制作Kimchi對每個韓國家庭來說都是重要的文化活動。Kimchi對韓國人來說是餐桌上的重點。
但是對中國人來說，Paocai并不是什么很重要的東西，雖然我在中國許多餐廳看到依然提供簡易的Paocai，但那絕對不是主角，在我的經(jīng)驗里，除了一些位于四川的中國朋友，大部分中國家庭也不會自己制作Paocai。
這種爭吵在第三方看來其實毫無價值
但兩國的民族主義者和一些媒體都借此獲得了良好的關(guān)注，他們故意混淆Paocai和Kimchi，使得這種爭吵年復(fù)一年地持續(xù)下去。
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Seriously. Who gives a f… where it originated from as long as one loves to eat it. Try both and eat what you like. It could be from Timbuktu for all I care. What next, who introduced dumplings?
真的。只要一個人喜歡吃，誰在乎它來自哪里呢。試試兩種，吃自己喜歡的。我才不在乎它是從哪里來的呢。接下來，誰來介紹下餃子？
Well that goes without saying, Chinese ! :) Actually, Korean mandu and Japanese gyoza are both so thin skinned that they resemble wontons. Chinese jiaozi on the other hand is more pasta like, with a thicker skin and more texture.
Note that the word I used is Jiaozi
Not dumplings
Dumplings is not Chinese, it's just a stupid translation used to refer to Chinese Jiaozi when the English vocabulary is too poor and there is no suitable vocabulary.
Please read to me: jiaozi
這是不言而喻的，中國的！:) 實際上，韓國的饅頭和日本的餃子都很薄，像餛飩。而中國的餃子則更像面食，皮更厚，口感更豐富。
注意，我用到的詞是Jiaozi
不是dumplings
dumplings不是中國的，它只是英語詞匯過于匱乏，沒有合適的詞匯時用于指代中國Jiaozi的愚蠢翻譯。
請跟我念：jiaozi
Next, who invented nasi lemak? Malaysia, Singapore or Indonesia?
接下來，誰發(fā)明了椰漿飯？馬來西亞、新加坡還是印度尼西亞？
The whole thing is ridiculous.
However, Chinese pickles are not just Sichuan paocai.
Except for subtropical parts of the country where fresh vegetables are available all year long, most parts of China gets through winter by pickling vegetables, some heavily salted, while others use Lactobacillus fermentation, resulting in suancai 酸菜, the Mandarin language equivalent of German sauerkraut: sour vegetables.
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In the south, mustard greens are more commonly used, including Hakka pickles
整件事都是荒謬的。
然而，中國的泡菜也不僅僅是四川泡菜。
除了全年都有新鮮蔬菜的亞熱帶地區(qū)外，中國大部分地區(qū)在冬季通過腌制蔬菜來度過，有些鹽很重，而其他地方則使用乳酸菌發(fā)酵，從而產(chǎn)生了酸菜，這是德國酸菜的普通話等價物：酸味的蔬菜。
與韓國的泡菜不同，中國東北的酸菜不使用辣椒，整個或半個的中國大白菜被放在巨大的缸中。
在南方，更常用的是芥菜，包括客家泡菜。
They like to steal Chinese culture.
他們喜歡竊取中國文化。
原創(chuàng)翻譯：龍騰網(wǎng) http://top-shui.cn 轉(zhuǎn)載請注明出處
Perhaps more interesting is the Chinese word for Seoul, wasn’t it called 漢城 historically? Now it’s 首爾. It’s their city, their choice.
也許更有趣的是，漢城的漢字歷史上是不是叫漢城？現(xiàn)在是首爾。這是他們的城市，他們的選擇。
Their city, their choice. What names Koreans choose to call their own country and cities is nobody else's business.
But there was no reason for China's Ministry of Foreign Affairs to comply and stop Chinese usage of the traditional name of 漢城, in support of Korea’s de-Hanification drive, erasing parts of history that did not sit well with modern Korean ethno-nationalist sensibilities.
China’s diplomats also abetted the cultural appropriation of 韓 by Koreans by accepting the usage of 韓國 by Korea, when the name was already taken by the Warring State of Han.
I support the Chinese government to change the Chinese name of South Korea to "南可弱"
他們的城市，他們的選擇。韓國人選擇用什么名字來稱呼他們自己的國家和城市，這不關(guān)別人的事。
但中國外交部沒有理由遵從，停止中國對漢城傳統(tǒng)名字的使用，支持韓國的去漢化運動，抹去了一些與現(xiàn)代韓國民族主義情感不符的歷史部分。
中國外交官還通過接受韓國使用“韓國”這一名稱來支持韓國人對“韓”的文化侵占，而這個名稱已經(jīng)被戰(zhàn)國時期的韓國采用了。
我支持中國政府將韓國的中文名字改為“南可弱”
漢城 or 首爾，Koreans always calls it ??. It doesn’t matter how other countries translate it. I wonder if it was Korea asking China to change the translation? Just like Laos can be translate into either 老撾 or 寮國. Who the fxxx care?
漢城或首爾，韓國人總是稱之為“??”。其他國家如何翻譯并不重要。我想知道是不是韓國要求中國改變翻譯的？就像老撾可以翻譯成“老撾”或“寮國”一樣。誰在乎？
Yes, Korea asked and got agreement from China to stop using 漢城 or 漢城。It was one of the conditions for establishing diplomatic relations withe the PRC.
Ironically, back when South Korea recognized the ROC, 漢城 was still used in Taiwan, including diplomats.
是的，韓國要求并得到了中國同意停止使用“漢城”或“漢城”。這是與中華人民共和國建立外交關(guān)系的條件之一。
具有諷刺意味的是，當(dāng)南韓承認(rèn)“中華民國”時，包括外交官在內(nèi)，臺灣仍然使用“漢城”。
In fact, chili peppers were introduced to China as food less than a few hundred years ago, and were first brought to Guangdong by colonists from South America during the Ming Dynasty, and the climate in Korea was not suitable for growing vegetables at all, let alone chili peppers. Until now, most Korean bok choy and chili peppers were imported from China
, and simple foods like spicy bok choy have long been one of the countless food preservation methods that ancient Chinese people tried.
事實上，辣椒是在幾百年前作為食物引入中國的，最初是在明朝時期由來自南美的殖民者帶到廣東的，而韓國的氣候根本不適合種植蔬菜，更別說辣椒了。直到現(xiàn)在，大多數(shù)韓國白菜和辣椒都是從中國進口的，而像辣白菜這樣的簡單食物長期以來一直是古代中國人嘗試的無數(shù)食物保存方法之一。
There are hundreds of different kinds of kimchi and paocai, not just the two examples used in this answer. Some types of Korean kimchi are just exactly the same as Chinese counterparts. Chili didn’t arrive in Asia till the 17th century so that was a later addition. Don’t think any country can claim to have invented this particular food category. But kimchi is much more important and prominent in the Korean kitchen than paocai in the Chinese kitchen, so for Koreans the food has significant cultural value. Apparently 90% of imported kimchi in Korea comes from China anyways.
泡菜和辛奇有數(shù)百種不同種類，不僅僅是本答案中使用的兩個例子。一些類型的韓國泡菜與中國泡菜完全一樣。辣椒直到17世紀(jì)才傳入亞洲，所以那是后來的添加。我認(rèn)為沒有任何國家可以聲稱發(fā)明這一特定的食品類別。但是泡菜在韓國廚房中比中國廚房中的泡菜更重要和更顯著，因此對于韓國人來說，這種食物具有重要的文化價值。據(jù)說，韓國90%的進口泡菜都來自中國。
Every culture has their unique way of preserving food. There is no such thing as a pure culture; all cultures has hybridized over the years through invasion, conquest, diffusion.
每種文化都有其獨特的食物保存方式。沒有純粹的文化；隨著入侵、征服和擴散，所有文化都在多年來進行了混合。
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kimchi, sushi was found first in land which now we called China. I mean a real kimchi just exactly like korean kimchi. maybe you can search in Chinese for the real history.
泡菜、壽司最初出現(xiàn)在我們現(xiàn)在稱之為中國的土地上。我的意思是真正的泡菜，就像韓國kimchi一樣。也許你可以用中文搜索真正的歷史。
human have been eating raw meat since early mankind.
人類從早期就開始食用生肉。
then who was original raw meat eater?
那么最初的生肉食者是誰呢？
that is an interesting information
這是一個有趣的信息。
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There are many kinds of kimchi, not the one the OP mentioned.
pa-kimchi, yeolmu-kimchi, dongchimi, nabak-kimchi, mat-kimchi
Please see the fifth and sixth types
The Korean people explain the kimchi by lobbying Codex Alimentarius: "a fermented food that uses salted napa cabbages as its main ingredient mixed with seasonings, and goes through a lactic acid production process at a low temperature。"
I think Sour cucumber is also a kind of kimchi, and it is also the Intangible Cultural Heritage of Humanity in South Korea.
kimchi有許多種，不是答主說的那一種
白菜kimchi、葉子kimchi、冬kimchi、納白菜kimchi、水kimchi
韓國人通過游說食品法典解釋泡菜：“泡菜是一種用鹽腌制的大白菜為主要原料混合調(diào)料發(fā)酵而成的食品，在低溫下進行乳酸生產(chǎn)過程?！?br /> 我認(rèn)為酸黃瓜也是一種泡菜，它也是韓國的人類非物質(zhì)文化遺產(chǎn)。
Did Korean eat any fresh Vege?
韓國人吃新鮮蔬菜嗎？
The fight is between whether Korea is some special isolate or if Korean culture was in fact spread across the region (and influenced by it) as a member of a greater geographic grouping. That’s all there is to this, it is pure nationalism rhetoric.
Also it has nothing to do with paocai. This is supposed to be about suancai and kimchi. Not to mention, kimchi is made by brining so you are wrong about it not being soaked in salt water. The process of the two is identical, but Koreans have a preference towards adding different things because spices are fun.
這場爭論是關(guān)于韓國是否是某種特殊的孤立體，或者韓國文化是否實際上作為一個更大地理群體的一部分而在該地區(qū)傳播（并受其影響）。這就是所有的，這是純粹的民族主義言論。
而且這與泡菜無關(guān)。這應(yīng)該是關(guān)于酸菜和泡菜的。更不用說，泡菜是用鹽水腌制的，所以你關(guān)于它不是浸泡在鹽水中的說法是錯誤的。這兩種方法的過程是相同的，但韓國人更喜歡添加不同的東西，因為香料很有趣。
Kimchi comes from my hometown, Sichuan. Kimchi has a long history in Sichuan. Korea is the inventor of the universe. The universe is Korean. Ha ha ha.
泡菜來自我的家鄉(xiāng)，四川。泡菜在四川有著悠久的歷史。韓國是宇宙的發(fā)明者。宇宙是韓國的。哈哈哈。
Yes, Paocai is from Sichuan, but as a Chinese friend, when you write in English, you must not write it as kimchi, as you are doing now.
We Chinese should stick to our cultural traditions and not use inappropriate English words to crudely explain our culture.
Paocai is not kimchi, Jiaozi is not dumpling either
沒錯泡菜來自四川，但是作為一位中國朋友，您在書寫英語時，一定不要將它寫作Kimchi，就像您現(xiàn)在做的這樣。
我們?nèi)A人應(yīng)該堅守自己的文化傳統(tǒng)，不要隨意使用不恰當(dāng)?shù)挠⒄Z詞匯來粗糙的解釋自己的文化
Paocai不是kimchi，Jiaozi也不是dumpling
What's important is what one want to eat for present, taste good be satisfy.
Meaningless quarrels, like kids do, & those who love quarrels do
Who's #1
Who make it 1st
Don't copy mine
It's my idea that you make it into reality, don't forget that
重要的是一個人現(xiàn)在想要吃什么，好吃就好。
無意義的爭論，就像孩子們所做的那樣，那些喜歡爭論的人也是如此
誰是第一名
誰最先創(chuàng)造
不要抄襲我的
是我的想法讓你變成現(xiàn)實的，別忘了這一點
Almost all nations from Ireland to Japan across most of the northern hemisphere make pickles of some kind. The colder the winter or shorter the growing season the more likely the culture is to make pickles. Cabbage is the most commonly pickled vegetable.
I grew up pickling fish in the Southern hemisphere. It's a solution to abundance and scarcity. Big catch of fish and no refrigeration so dry or pickle fish in vinegar and put it in jars, store it in a cool place. Drying required specific climatic conditions so is more challenging.
幾乎所有從愛爾蘭到日本跨越北半球大部分地區(qū)的國家都制作某種泡菜。冬季越冷或生長季節(jié)越短，這種文化制作泡菜的可能性就越大。卷心菜是最常用的腌制蔬菜。
我在南半球長大，腌制魚。這是應(yīng)付豐富和稀缺矛盾的解決方案。捕撈到大量的魚，但沒有冷藏設(shè)備，所以將魚干燥或腌制在醋中，并放入罐子中，存放在涼爽的地方。干燥需要特定的氣候條件，因此更具挑戰(zhàn)性。
Re “worthless”: media likes it as it generates traffic?
關(guān)于“無價值”：媒體喜歡這個詞因為它能帶來流量
Lol, Who cares. When the fridge was not existed, most of foods were preserved by fermentation in all cultures. Guess Korean loved hot food, just put ton of hot pepper to make fermented foods more tastier, even gave a name Kimchi.
I was growing up in 60’s, 70’s, China was totally isolated from outside of world, my grandma made tons different sort of fermented veggies similar like Kimchi, not exactly tasted as Kimchi since there was no shrimp or fish paste in my hometown area.
哈哈，誰在乎呢。冰箱還不存在的時候，幾乎所有文化中的大部分食物都是通過發(fā)酵來保存的。我猜韓國人喜歡吃辣食，只是放了大量辣椒讓發(fā)酵食物更加美味，甚至給了個名字叫Kimchi。
我在60年代、70年代長大，當(dāng)時中國與外界完全隔絕，我奶奶做了大量與Kimchi類似的發(fā)酵蔬菜，盡管口味不完全像Kimchi，因為我家鄉(xiāng)沒有蝦或魚醬。
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It’s impossible for Korean to have anything or invented anything complete independently, it is just not possible since they share the same board line with China. Anything Korean has is likely to be evolved and influenced over time between the north east China provinces and Korea, i.e they learn and borrowed from each other.
I guess, as a small and marginal country, supplies are scarce. So a fermented food that seemed insignificant to the Chinese became their precious food.
So they care very much and really want it to "belong to them", even though it must be more or less influenced by China.
And China is like a nouveau riche. They have so many things that they don’t have time to take care of each one. But just like a child, I don’t have to play with my toys, but I can’t give them to you.
韓國人完全獨立地?fù)碛谢虬l(fā)明任何東西是不可能的，因為他們與中國共享同一邊界。韓國擁有的任何東西都可能是隨著時間在中國東北省和韓國之間演變和受到影響的，即它們相互學(xué)習(xí)和借鑒。
我猜，作為一個邊緣小國，物資匱乏。所以一種在中國人看來無關(guān)緊要的發(fā)酵食品，成了他們寶貴的食物。
所以他們非常在意，非常希望它”屬于自己“，盡管它必然或多或少的受到中國的影響。
而中國就像一個暴發(fā)戶，他們有太多東西，多到都沒有時間去照顧每一種。但是就和小孩子一樣，我的玩具可以不玩，但是我不能給你。
That reminds me repeated argument between governments of Singapore and Malaysia over same issues (eg water deals between the 2 countries).
Basically both countries do not get much attention in world’s politics. And news reported in media of both countries are boring. So the governments put up arguments on and off to stir up attentions amongst their people, and so increase sales of media products at the same time. Arguments would cool down eventually without any conclusion and awaiting for another stirring up.
At the end, government officers of both countries would have coffee together in posh establishments, celebrating the attention they have gained. This is important for prevailing ruling parties of both countries to gain votes during general elections. So this is the Pakat of the Century for both.
For their people, they will also having coffee together in less posh establishments to Ma Zheng Hu (scolding government) together. Sales of establishments would also increase meanwhile.
In short,don’t give a damn to arguments between governments and think positively. The world would be in peace.
這讓我想起新加坡和馬來西亞政府之間就同樣問題（如兩國之間的水資源協(xié)議）反復(fù)爭論。
基本上，這兩個國家在世界政治中并沒有受到太多關(guān)注。兩國媒體報道的新聞都很無聊。因此，政府會時不時地發(fā)表爭論，激起人民的關(guān)注，同時增加媒體產(chǎn)品的銷售量。爭論最終會冷卻下來，沒有任何結(jié)論，并等待下一次的激起。
最后，兩國政府官員會在高檔場所一起喝咖啡，慶祝他們獲得的關(guān)注。這對于兩國的執(zhí)政黨在大選中獲得選票至關(guān)重要。所以這對兩國來說是本世紀(jì)的合作。
對于他們的人民來說，他們也會在較不高檔的場所一起喝咖啡，一起罵政府。場所的銷售額也會同時增加。
簡而言之，不要在政府之間的爭論上耗費精力，要積極思考。世界將會和平。
picklin vs fermentin, them r both a way to preserve a food prior fridge invention?
腌制與發(fā)酵，它們都是在冰箱發(fā)明之前保存食物的一種方式嗎？
補充一下作者：用鹽水泡的我們四川通常叫泡菜或酸菜，像韓國那種通過晾曬去水后，再通過調(diào)料腌制的，四川一般叫鹽菜（或腌菜），這是2種不同工藝，有著同樣悠久的歷史，不同于韓國，在我們大多數(shù)餐桌上的地位，這2個只是小菜，有無都無所謂。當(dāng)初和韓國產(chǎn)生爭論的是鹽菜，不是泡菜。
Fermenting vegetables isn’t unique for either Korea or China.
Polish kapusta kiszona (soured cabbage) is made in similar way like Korean kimchi. The main fermenting agent is salt.
Ogórki kiszone (soured cucumbers) are made like Chinese paocai, in salt water solution.
腌制蔬菜并不是韓國或中國獨有的。
波蘭的kapusta kiszona（酸白菜）的制作方式與韓國的泡菜類似。主要的發(fā)酵劑是鹽。
Ogórki kiszone（酸黃瓜）的制作方式類似于中國的泡菜，使用鹽水溶液。
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You seem to have not taken into account the distribution of chili pepper cultivation in history. Korea introduced kimchi because of the Sichuan garrison. They don’t have conditions of eating chili pepper in ancient times.
你似乎沒有考慮到歷史上辣椒種植的分布情況。韓國之所以引入泡菜，是因為四川的駐軍。他們古代沒有吃辣椒的條件。