美國的STEM畢業(yè)生短缺比我們想象的要嚴重得多

America's STEM graduates shortage is much worse than we thought.

2024-06-07 大號兒童 6571 33 10 收藏糾錯&舉報

譯文簡介

美國嚴重缺乏我們在未來關(guān)鍵行業(yè)中競爭所需的工程師和科學家。隨著STEM畢業(yè)生充分就業(yè)，并且已經(jīng)享有世界上最高的薪酬水平，事實證明，企業(yè)很難找到新的工程人才。

正文翻譯

The United States is critically short of the engineers and scientists we need to compete in the key industries of the future. With STEM graduates at full employment, and already enjoying the highest pay scales in the world, it is proving highly difficult for companies to find new engineering talent.

美國嚴重缺乏我們在未來關(guān)鍵行業(yè)中競爭所需的工程師和科學家。隨著STEM畢業(yè)生充分就業(yè)，并且已經(jīng)享有世界上最高的薪酬水平，事實證明，企業(yè)很難找到新的工程人才。

A close look at the enrollment data for students in STEM fields in US universities, however, reveals that over half of those students are international, and about 80% will be returning to their home countries after graduation. Instead of having over 800,000 new STEM graduates annually, the United States will only see about 500,000 of them join companies in the United States, which puts the US behind China, India, and Russia.

然而，仔細研究美國大學STEM領(lǐng)域?qū)W生的入學數(shù)據(jù)就會發(fā)現(xiàn)，這些學生中有一半以上是國際學生，約80%的學生將在畢業(yè)后返回祖國。而不是每年有超過80萬的新STEM畢業(yè)生，美國只有大約50萬人加入美國公司，這使得美國落后于中國、印度和俄羅斯。

評論翻譯

@latiendaca1773 I read somewhere, that ~70% of China’s leaders have engineer degrees. Versus ours having law backgrounds.

我在某處讀到，大約 70% 的中國領(lǐng)導人擁有工程師學位。與我們有法律背景的人相比。

@F_Liu Over 1,400 Chinese scientists have dropped their American university or corporate affiliations and returned to China in 2021, based on their publication records, and 4 in 10 scientists of Chinese descent at elite American universities are considering leaving.

根據(jù)他們的發(fā)表記錄，超過 1,400 名中國科學家于 2021 年放棄了美國大學或企業(yè)的隸屬關(guān)系并返回中國，美國精英大學的華裔科學家中有十分之四正在考慮離開。

@liberty-matrix "The number one most aspired to career in China, among young teenagers that were surveyed is an 'Astronaut'. The number one most aspired to a career in the U.S. is a 'Social Media Influencer', that is all you need to know to understand the collapse of the West." ~Tristan Harris

“在接受調(diào)查的中國青少年中，最想從事的職業(yè)是‘宇航員’。在美國，最想從事的職業(yè)是‘社交媒體影響者’，這就是你了解西方崩潰所需要知道的一切?！眫特里斯坦·哈里斯

@priscillaferguson267 All of my Chinese and Japanese foreign student that I’ve hosted have returned to China and Japan after receiving their Master’s Engineering Degrees. Why??? The fear of being singled out as a spy due to ignorant bigotry and xenophobia.

我接待過的所有中國和日本留學生都在獲得工程碩士學位后回到了中國和日本。為什么? ?由于無知的偏執(zhí)和仇外心理，害怕被當成間諜挑出來。

@kl9518 10 years ago, I went to the Royal College of Art in London, the top design school in the UK. The automotive subject only takes 12 students a year. 2 were British, and the rest were Chinese, Korean, and Japanese. Now we see that some of the best cars in the world come from these East Asian countries.

10年前，10年前，我去了英國頂尖的設(shè)計學院倫敦皇家藝術(shù)學院。汽車專業(yè)每年只招收12名學生。2名是英國人，其余的是中國人、韓國人和日本人。現(xiàn)在我們看到，世界上一些最好的汽車來自這些東亞國家。
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davidlee9493 Too many lawyers. Too few engineers. There was a time when foreign students overwhelmingly choose to remain in the U.S. Not anymore. The grass is now greener on the other side. You can't stem the tide.

太多律師了。工程師太少了。曾經(jīng)有一段時間，絕大多數(shù)外國學生選擇留在美國。這山望著那山高。風水輪流轉(zhuǎn)。

@Spyderman500 I work at a state university in the engineering department. We aggressively recruit international students because they pay more intuition. This is what happens when you don’t invest in your people

我在工程系的一所州立大學工作。我們積極招收國際學生，因為他們支付更高的學費。這就是當你不投資于本國人民時會發(fā)生的情況。 @duinay3

the US has always imported their talent from abroad - it's possible that talent may no longer find the US attractive to be anymore

美國一直從國外引進人才——有可能人才不再覺得美國有吸引力了

@Ace1000ks19751982 Math and science education is really mediocre in the US. If you want to major in engineering, you have to be good in subjects, like math, physics, and chemistry.

美國的數(shù)學和科學教育真的很平庸。如果你想主修工程，你必須在數(shù)學、物理和化學等學科上表現(xiàn)出色。

When I was going to university back in the mid 1990s, I would say about 80% of the people in the higher math(Calculus 1 - 3, Differential Equations, Linear Algebra, etc), and physical science courses(physics, chemistry, thermodynamics) were mostly foreigners. In the US, you have more lawyers than scientists and engineers, so this is why the country is at the state that it is in now.

當我在90年代中期上大學的時候，我可以說80%的高等數(shù)學(微積分1 - 3，微分方程，線性代數(shù)等)和物理科學課程(物理，化學，熱力學)的學生大多是外國人。在美國，律師比科學家和工程師還多，所以這就是為什么這個國家現(xiàn)在處于這個狀態(tài)。

@RichardBrett899 In summary, America is low in manufacturing capacity and low in talent pool, but has high inflation.

總而言之，美國的制造能力和人才儲備都很低，但通貨膨脹率很高。

@knaraya936 My son is a PhD in Condensed Matter Physics and a US Citizen who works on SemiconductorMaterials research in a post doctoral capacity. He has been trying to find a job in semiconductor process manufacturing for several years now. The reason is that semiconductor fabs in America has just laid off thousands of experienced semiconductor people over the past two years. Hiring entry-level is very expensive and there are no entry level jobs (that need a PhD as a minimum) posted anymore. Posting is only for experienced people. Colleges, universities, trade schools don’t have training for semiconductor people. Companies need to invest a minimum of 6 months in a new hire. This can be done at a much lower cost overseas - Taiwan, Japan, Korea, Singapore.

我的兒子是凝聚態(tài)物理學博士學位，也是一名美國公民，以博士后身份從事半導體材料研究。幾年來，他一直想在半導體制造行業(yè)找到一份工作。原因是美國的半導體工廠在過去兩年中剛剛解雇了數(shù)千名有經(jīng)驗的半導體人員。招聘入門級的工作非常昂貴，而且已經(jīng)沒有入門級的工作(至少需要博士學位)了。發(fā)帖只適合有經(jīng)驗的人。學院、大學、職業(yè)學校沒有針對半導體人員的培訓。公司需要在新員工身上投入至少6個月的時間。這可以在海外以更低的成本完成——臺灣地區(qū)、日本、韓國、新加坡。

@AIPretendingToBeHuman I think you have to ask the question, Why is the cost of living in the US so high that you need 3-5x the salary compared to China to live the same lifestyle ? Why does housing, healthcare, education (the basic necessities), cost 3-7x more in the US than in China. Unless we can answer that basic question it is going to be increasingly difficult to be competitive in the world.

我想你必須問一個問題，為什么美國的生活成本如此之高，以至于你需要比中國高3-5倍的工資才能過上同樣的生活?為什么美國的住房、醫(yī)療、教育(基本必需品)比中國貴3-7倍。除非我們能回答這個基本問題，否則在世界上保持競爭力將變得越來越困難。
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@stephenc6955 A law degree is where it's at. We live in a litigious country, we will litigate our way to success.

法律學位才是最重要的。我們生活在一個愛打官司的國家，我們將打官司作為通往成功的道路。

@rfengr00 During my MSEE almost 30 years ago, 28 of 30 students in my digital signal processing class were Asian foreign nationals, mostly Taiwan, Korean, and India. The mainland Chinese were starting to study here en-masse. Of course a generation later, Taiwan dominates semiconductors (Korea too) They (Morris Chang) had a master plan from the late 80’s. America doesn’t think past one financial quarter.

大約30年前，在我的MSEE期間，我的數(shù)字信號處理班的30名學生中有28名是亞洲外國人，主要是臺灣人、韓國和印度人。中國大陸人開始大批來這里學習。當然，一代之后，臺灣地區(qū)在半導體領(lǐng)域占據(jù)主導地位（韓國也是如此），他們(張忠謀)從80年代末就有了一個總體規(guī)劃。美國人只考慮一個財政季度。

@roberts5197 I was in San Francisco in 1991. Berkeley had a big debate going on because they were reserving 10% of the places for disadvantaged Asians and the white American students were completing that entry should be on merit. I was there 10 years later in 2001, Berkeley were reserving 10% for white Americans and the Asian students were complaining that entry should be on merit. The American education system had been going downhill for 30+ years.

1991 年我在舊金山。伯克利正在進行一場大辯論，因為他們?yōu)樘幘巢焕膩喼奕吮Ａ袅?10% 的名額，而美國白人學生則應根據(jù)成績完成入學。 10 年后的 2001 年，我來到了那里，伯克利為美國白人保留了 10% 的獎學金，而亞洲學生則抱怨入學應該根據(jù)成績而定。美國的教育體系30多年來一直在走下坡路。

@Kotak8 The U.S. national leaders, lawmakers in the senate & Hse Representatives mostly had their degrees in law and political science. In contrary, Chinese leaders obtained engineering, science,maths, IT, economics, accountancy.

美國國家領(lǐng)導人、參議院議員和眾議院議員大多擁有法學和政治學學位。相反，中國領(lǐng)導人獲得了工程、科學、數(shù)學、信息技術(shù)、經(jīng)濟、會計等方面的優(yōu)勢。

@SteveBurg2001 Okay, I'm an American... and when I see these reports, I find myself asking "Are we serious?" Because if we are, then everything has to change - and fast!

好吧，我是美國人……當我看到這些報道時，我發(fā)現(xiàn)自己在問“我們是認真的嗎？” 因為如果我們是這樣，那么一切都必須改變——而且要快！

@apl1568 It doesn't help that students go through the pain of getting computer science degrees, etc., and then can't get jobs because "they don't have experience", while in fact the jobs are being outsourced. Americans are are hyper-focused on short-term profits. They'll happily outsource everything they can at the expense of the future economic well being of their country.

學生們經(jīng)歷了獲得計算機科學學位等的痛苦，然后因為“他們沒有經(jīng)驗”而找不到工作，這對他們沒有幫助，而事實上，這些工作正在被外包。美國人過于關(guān)注短期利益。他們會很樂意將一切可以外包的事情外包出去，但以犧牲國家未來的經(jīng)濟福祉為代價。

@leonardpearlman4017 As a chronically underemployed and now involuntarily retired STEM kind of guy... I would like to mention something I have noticed: When people HERE in the US talk about work place issues, wages, staffing problems and so on- (in my impression) they seem to be wrong, no matter what they are saying! Published information in general doesn't seem to align with what you can actually observe. It seems like news from a similar but different world! BOSS WORLD? I could go on at great length about this, and none of it would make anyone happier. We are clamoring for machinist-mechanic-welder-electronic technician-programmers (say), and there aren't many people LIKE THAT, there's no plan to have a process to create them! The people who ARE like that are mostly men, mostly way over fifty, and often unemployed or underemployed, prematurely retired! There's a lot of variety though, everyone's mileage varies amazingly.

作為一個長期未充分就業(yè)，現(xiàn)在非自愿退休的STEM類家伙…我想提一下我注意到的一些事情:當美國人談論工作場所問題、工資問題、人員問題等等——(在我的印象中)不管他們說什么，他們似乎都是錯的！一般來說，公布的信息似乎與你實際觀察到的并不一致。這似乎是來自一個相似但不同的世界的消息! 老板的世界? 關(guān)于這一點，我可以用很長的篇幅來談論這件事，但沒有一件事能使任何人感到高興。我們迫切需要機械師-機械師-焊工-電子技術(shù)員-程序員(比如說)，而像這樣的人并不多，沒有計劃有一個過程來創(chuàng)造他們!這樣的人大多是男人，大多超過50歲，而且經(jīng)常失業(yè)或未充分就業(yè)，過早退休! 盡管種類繁多，但每個人的里程數(shù)卻相差很大。
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@XFinityDesigns If Americans travel abroad, they will be shocked. I recently returned from a Middle Eastern country. There are more Chinese cars, phones, technology than there are American. Planes, trains, you name it.

如果美國人出國旅游，他們會感到震驚。我最近剛從一個中東國家回來。中國的汽車、手機和技術(shù)都比美國的多。飛機，火車，應有盡有。

@brianliew5901 China has a 5,000 year history and it'll take the US approximately 4752 years just to understand what China is doing.

中國有5000年的歷史，美國要花4752年才能理解中國在做什么。

@1millionstartups Semiconductors doesn't need the best engineers; it needs the most dedicated engineers because each batch needs to be watched over and cared for like an infant from conception to final assembly, and each step (and there're thousands) can render the batch (or a few wafers) useless and loss of $ thousands or millions. Imagine doing this every day for 12-16 hours and getting paid less than a MBA who figured out in the US how bad the ROI is in a STEM career, a semiconductor fab or factories of any kind, vs. hyping up Tesla, Nvidia, AMC or Hertz stocks.

半導體不需要最好的工程師;它需要最敬業(yè)的工程師，因為從構(gòu)思到最終組裝，每個批次都需要像嬰兒一樣受到監(jiān)督和照顧，而每個步驟（有數(shù)千個）都可能使該批次（或幾塊晶圓）變得無用和損失數(shù)千或數(shù)百萬美元。想象一下，每天花 12 到 16 個小時做這件事，得到的報酬還比一個 MBA 還低，他在美國發(fā)現(xiàn) STEM 職業(yè)、半導體工廠或任何類型的工廠的投資回報率有多糟糕，而不是大肆宣傳特斯拉、Nvidia、 AMC 或赫茲股票。

@M.M.Alam.Liberty Kevin. Remember that US wanted to de-industrialize which means they have to drastically reduce chances of more STEM grads in the future.

凱文. 請記住，美國想要去工業(yè)化，這意味著他們必須大幅減少未來更多 STEM 畢業(yè)生的機會。

@shaonghosh1 The consideration of what fraction of STEM students are American is an important one. Most of the students are Chinese and Indian (at least used to be). In the past, it mattered little because of the great pull of the chance to immigrate to America. However, the US immigration system has become a hopeless endeavor for a large section of people from these countries. So, the US universities are essentially training students from these countries and letting them go back to their home country or other countries to contribute to the economy of those countries. I personally know three Indian Ph.D. students who were financially supported by US universities for 5–6 years (TAs and RAs), had full tuition waivers, and then had to leave the country because of decade-long green card backlogs after completing their OPT. US taxpayers paid for their studies, only for them to leave and pay taxes in some other countries. So, indeed, subtracting that number from the "US-category" is the sensible thing to do.

考慮到STEM學生中有多少是美國人是一個重要的問題。大多數(shù)學生是中國人和印度人(至少曾經(jīng)是)。在過去，由于移民美國的機會具有巨大的吸引力，這并不重要。然而，對于這些國家的大部分人來說，美國的移民制度已經(jīng)成為一項無望的努力。因此，美國大學本質(zhì)上是在培訓來自這些國家的學生，讓他們回到自己的國家或其他國家，為這些國家的經(jīng)濟做出貢獻。我個人認識三名印度博士生，他們得到了美國大學5-6年的經(jīng)濟支持(助教和博士)，全額學費減免，但在完成OPT后，由于綠卡積壓長達十年之久，不得不離開美國。美國納稅人為他們的學習支付了費用，只是為了讓他們離開并在其他一些國家納稅。因此，事實上，從“美國類別”中減去這個數(shù)字是明智的做法。

@horridohobbies According to the World Economic Forum, in 2016, China had 4.7m STEM graduates while USA had 568,000. That's a ratio of 8:1. So I'm supposed to believe that 4 years later, China had 3.57m STEM graduates to USA's 820,000 for a ratio of 4:1, according to CSET, an American think tank??? Colour me skeptical. I think CSET inflated the US number. This is simply common sense. They're counting foreign students who graduate, then leave the USA. Kevin, your research is spot on, as usual.

根據(jù)世界經(jīng)濟論壇的數(shù)據(jù)，2016年，中國有470萬STEM畢業(yè)生，而美國有56.8萬。也就是8：1的比例。所以我應該相信，根據(jù)美國智庫CSET的數(shù)據(jù)，4年后，中國有357萬名STEM畢業(yè)生，而美國有82萬名，比例為4:1？？？讓我感到懷疑。我認為CSET夸大了美國的數(shù)字。這是常識。他們計算的是那些畢業(yè)后離開美國的外國學生。凱文，和往常一樣，你的研究很到位。
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@catinbootsnow4267 AI in the US is mainly focusing on robots chatting like real lawyers, journalists, politicians, freelancers, TV archors, and entertainers. AI in China is mainly focusing on robots working like real engineers, programmers, workers, drivers, teachers, doctors, nurses, and farmers. A little amusing.

在美國，人工智能主要集中在像真正的律師、記者、政治家、自由職業(yè)者、電視主持人和藝人一樣聊天的機器人上。中國的人工智能主要集中在像真正的工程師、程序員、工人、司機、教師、醫(yī)生、護士和農(nóng)民一樣工作的機器人上。有點好笑。

@phyybalance2601 The reason is very simple and may shock some of you. The foundation for science, engineering, and math majors starts in elementary school. Students who flunked their math and science in elementary, middle, and high school will never ever be able to major in the engineering degree. Asian education systems put a lot of attention in math and science since elementary school so they are much more likely to major in the engineering degree.

原因很簡單，可能會讓你們中的一些人感到震驚。科學、工程和數(shù)學專業(yè)的基礎(chǔ)從小學就開始了。在小學、初中和高中數(shù)學和科學不及格的學生將永遠無法主修工程學位。從小學開始，亞洲的教育體系就非常重視數(shù)學和科學，所以他們更有可能主修工程學位。

@steaminglobster My friend worked in Cornell university told me: the funding of the professors get now is 10% of 10 years ago. USA does not have serious engineering projects/industry anymore. So what does USA GDP made of? I guess it is made of lots of blah blah blah.

我在康奈爾大學工作的朋友告訴我:現(xiàn)在教授得到的資金是10年前的10%。美國不再有嚴肅的工程項目/工業(yè)了。那么美國的GDP是由什么構(gòu)成的呢?我猜它是由很多廢話組成的。
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@DanBurgaud 0:48 Just so everyone knows, the American Math Team that won the Math Olympics in 2021 was composed exclusively of Chinese Students...

0:48大家都知道，贏得2021年數(shù)學奧林匹克的美國數(shù)學隊完全是由中國學生組成的…

@coliv2 The US companies are currently in a bid to lay off as many STEAM workers as possible! Given that fact, it is no surprise that nobody will want to become an engineer in this country.

美國企業(yè)目前正力圖裁員盡可能多的STEAM員工！鑒于這一事實，在這個國家沒有人想成為一名工程師也就不足為奇了。

@paintitblack4199 The US may have higher pay in those jobs, but with inflation and the cost of living it's probably on par with China and other nations, not to mention housing costs and healthcare being ridiculous.

美國可能在這些工作中有更高的工資，但考慮到通貨膨脹和生活成本，它可能與中國和其他國家相當，更不用說住房成本和醫(yī)療成本了。

@user-xp4of2vu4r You can bet then number includes anyone who graduated from an USA school. From what I read, most of the good schools depend on foreign student tuitions to make budget.

你可以打賭，這個數(shù)字包括所有從美國學校畢業(yè)的人。據(jù)我所知，大多數(shù)好學校都依靠外國學生的學費來制定預算。

@mijmijrm the essence of Science/Engineering is the ability to perceive actual physical evidential reality and differentiate it from imagination. To retain its grip on power, the Establishment Political Power requires that the average American exists in a realm of fantasy and is unable to determine what is reality. So, it's preferable that the average American is kept away from Science/Engineering.

科學/工程的本質(zhì)是感知實際的物理證據(jù)現(xiàn)實并將其與想象區(qū)分開來的能力。為了保持對權(quán)力的控制，建制派政治權(quán)力要求普通美國人生活在幻想之中，無法確定什么是現(xiàn)實。所以，最好讓普通美國人遠離科學/工程。

美國 STEM 畢業(yè)生 想象

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