隨著利潤和銷售暴跌，中國準(zhǔn)備收購斯特蘭提斯的標(biāo)志性品牌（一）
China prepares to buy Stellantis' iconic brands as Profits and sales CRASH
譯文簡介
網(wǎng)友：我認(rèn)為堅持投資不受經(jīng)濟政策影響的股票很重要。人工智能股票有潛力推動和改變未來的技術(shù)。似乎大多數(shù)公司都在走人工智能的發(fā)展軌跡，甚至包括老牌的 FAANG 公司。也許還有其他建議？
正文翻譯
China prepares to buy Stellantis' iconic brands as Profits and sales CRASH.
隨著利潤和銷售暴跌，中國準(zhǔn)備收購斯特蘭提斯的標(biāo)志性品牌。
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隨著利潤和銷售暴跌，中國準(zhǔn)備收購斯特蘭提斯的標(biāo)志性品牌。
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I think it's important to stick to stocks that are immune to economic policies. AI stocks that have the potential to power and transform future technologies. It seems AI is the trajectory most companies are taking, including even established FAANG companies. Maybe there are other recommendations?
我認(rèn)為堅持投資不受經(jīng)濟政策影響的股票很重要。人工智能股票有潛力推動和改變未來的技術(shù)。似乎大多數(shù)公司都在走人工智能的發(fā)展軌跡，甚至包括老牌的 FAANG 公司。也許還有其他建議？
I manage a stellantis dealership. By far this is the worst I've ever seen, lying, holding seperate meetings with dealerships, trying to get dealers to order more cars by giving empty promises.
我管理一家斯特蘭提斯經(jīng)銷店。到目前為止，這是我見過的最糟糕的情況，撒謊、與經(jīng)銷店單獨開會、試圖通過給出空洞的承諾讓經(jīng)銷商訂購更多汽車。
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Chinese automakers are smart. Too smart to be conned into buying the dued “Jeep” name.
中國汽車制造商很聰明。他們太聰明了，不會受騙購買貶值的“吉普”品牌。
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Useless, underperforming and grossly overpaid CEO, did I mention that he is GROSSLY overpaid?
無用、表現(xiàn)不佳、薪水過高CEO，我有沒有提過他的薪水過高？
Stellantis is what happens when a bunch of failing legacy auto companies tries to survive...
當(dāng)一群瀕臨失敗的傳統(tǒng)汽車公司努力生存時，就會發(fā)生斯特蘭提斯這種事......
Chinese automakers should not buy their brand names because I remember during my school days 40 yrs ago that Alfa and Fiat cars were highly unreliable. Why would I want to associate myself with such a tarnished reputation.
中國汽車制造商不應(yīng)該購買他們的品牌，因為我記得 40 年前我上學(xué)的時候，阿爾法和菲亞特汽車非常不可靠。我為什么要把自己與這種聲譽不佳的品牌扯上關(guān)系。
PSA was doing quite well and when they bought Opel from GM it took just two years for Opel to turn its first profit in decades. The merger with FCA was too big a byte to swallow.
標(biāo)致雪鐵龍集團表現(xiàn)相當(dāng)不錯，當(dāng)他們從通用汽車手中收購歐寶時，歐寶僅用了兩年時間就實現(xiàn)了數(shù)十年來的首次盈利。與 菲亞特克萊斯勒的合并對標(biāo)致雪鐵龍集團來說是一個難以接受的打擊。
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If I were Chinese companies, I would not buy American brands, Jeep, Chrysler, Dodge. I might consider Italian brands such as Maserati and Alfa.
如果我是中國公司，我不會購買美國品牌，比如吉普、克萊斯勒、道奇。我可能會考慮意大利品牌，比如瑪莎拉蒂和阿爾法。
They have a 10 year supply already on dealer lots
經(jīng)銷商手上已經(jīng)有10年的供應(yīng)量了
Your assessment is on-the-money.
你的評估很準(zhǔn)確。
Most of it is because of them doing some of the worst markups ever in history during the tail end and after the pandemic....it was so bad, some people have swore off the brands.
大部分原因是他們在疫情末期和疫情過后進行了歷史上最糟糕的漲價......情況非常糟糕，有些人已經(jīng)放棄了這些品牌。
In SEA Maserati is known as a cheap expensive brand.
在東南亞，瑪莎拉蒂被稱為廉價而昂貴的品牌。
Dodge and Jeep are toast. They are no longer affordable!
道奇和吉普完蛋了。它們不再便宜了！
It is simple
Europe has too much pride in their brands. It is emotional. Your first love next to you in your small 500cc fiat cruising through Toscane. Fiat is a feel. Not only a brand. It has nostalgia. Europe is not getting it. That time has past. We need a clean planet with new transportation . China took the lead since they do not have any sentiment and are looking forward.
I predict that the Europeans will soon build cars for the Chinese to keep Jobs. It is over with luxury european lifestyle. Pronto
很簡單，歐洲人對他們的品牌太過自豪了。這是一種情感。你的初戀坐在你的 500cc 菲亞特小車?yán)铮谕兴箍{巡游。菲亞特是一種感覺。不僅僅是一個品牌。它有懷舊之情。歐洲人沒有領(lǐng)會到這一點。那個時代已經(jīng)過去了。我們需要一個清潔的地球和新的交通方式。中國率先行動，因為他們沒有任何類似情緒，而且充滿期待。
我預(yù)測歐洲人很快就會為中國人制造汽車，以保住工作。奢華的歐洲生活方式已經(jīng)結(jié)束。
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I have had 2 jeep Cherokees in last 7 years loved them both stayed to buy another nothing in stock and no answer when? The price point was great and a med. Size suv.
過去 7 年我擁有過 2 輛吉普切諾基，兩輛都很喜歡，后來又買了一輛，但庫存不足，也沒有人回答什么時候有？價格很合適，是一款中型 SUV。
Auto Makers are on their own this time around . The US Government is in no position to Bail them out for their insane decision making .
這次汽車制造商只能靠自己了。美國政府沒有能力為他們瘋狂的決策提供救助。
Imagine if China bought every single car company.
想象一下，如果中國收購了所有的汽車公司。
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Stellantis has been one of the most profitable car company in the world.
I think they went too far in the premiumisation.
斯特蘭蒂斯 一直是全球最賺錢的汽車公司之一。
我認(rèn)為他們在高端化方面做得太過了。
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Stalans can only get in trouble if they falsify their financials or provide bogus investor guidance. Consumers can sue them over a defect in one of their cars. I’m not sure what other grounds they could be sued on.
斯特蘭蒂斯只有在偽造財務(wù)數(shù)據(jù)或提供虛假投資者指導(dǎo)時才會惹上麻煩。消費者可以因汽車缺陷起訴他們。我不確定他們還會因什么其他理由被起訴。
The brands were bought by stelantis but never improved. The only think that happened is they raised prices. You can only hide behind a brand name for so long before the truth comes out
這些品牌被斯特蘭蒂斯 收購，但從未改善。唯一發(fā)生的事情是他們提高了價格。在真相大白之前，你只能在一個品牌名稱背后躲藏一段時間
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Having European executive Carlos run groups like Jeep or RAM and expecting them to do well is pure hubris. He would have no concept of the ethos either of those brands.
讓歐洲高管卡洛斯管理 Jeep 或 RAM 等集團，并期望它們?nèi)〉贸晒兇馐强裢源蟆Ｋ静涣私膺@兩個品牌的精神。
As more countries join BRICS and China buys up all the car brands, the increased market for cars from the BRICS countries could use up all the Chinese produced vehicles leaving none for USA and Europe.
隨著越來越多的國家加入金磚國家，中國收購所有汽車品牌，金磚國家汽車市場的擴大可能會消耗掉中國生產(chǎn)的所有汽車，從而導(dǎo)致美國和歐洲的汽車庫存減少。
Good for you calling out on their lies
你揭穿他們的謊言真是太好了
Did you day Stalantis made a profit. That's a novelty in the car industry atm.
你知道斯特蘭蒂斯盈利了嗎？這在汽車行業(yè)目前還是新鮮事。
MG and Volvo were rebuilt by their Chinese owners. I think more brands will be sold to them. Japan might have to follow when they start to fold. I'm thinking Nissan, Diahatsu, Suzuki, Mazda and eventually Mitsubishi and Subaru. With a 70+% reduction in the motor vehicle market worldwide, there are not going to be many brands left unscathed.
MG 和沃爾沃被中國所有者重建。我認(rèn)為會有更多的品牌被賣給他們。當(dāng)它們開始倒閉時，日本可能不得不效仿。我認(rèn)為日產(chǎn)、戴哈特、鈴木、馬自達以及三菱和斯巴魯最終也會倒閉。隨著全球汽車市場萎縮 70% 以上，不會有多少品牌能毫發(fā)無損。
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I would suggest that the real problem with all of the legacy automakers are their boards of directors. The choose the executives who run these companies and they set the agenda.
Herbert was removed from his position by the board of directors of the VW group and look how bad that turned out for VW.
我認(rèn)為所有傳統(tǒng)汽車制造商的真正問題在于他們的董事會。他們選擇了管理這些公司的高管，并制定議程。
赫伯特被大眾集團董事會免職，看看這對大眾來說有多糟糕。
Car sales collapse when people can't afford them. The biggest market is the bottom end. There must be a lower limit to cost, just based on the cost of materials. Even if your factory is all automation and robots, you still need to hire people to take care of the machines, and move material.
當(dāng)人們買不起汽車時，汽車銷量就會下降。最大的市場是低端市場。成本必須有一個下限，僅基于材料成本。即使你的工廠全自動化和機器人，你仍然需要雇人來照看機器和搬運材料。
The last traditional American brand car I owned was a Ford EXP. It was a nice looking car and ran fine for a few years but at one point it started to have electrical issues and it would leave me stranded and it would simply refuse to start until it suddenly would decide to start again. This massively turned me off from buying an American car. My next 6 cars were Toyota cars and everyone ran wonderful and lasted 10 years and then I sold them so I could get a new car again. Recently I bought two Tesla cars. The first 5 months has been great for the model Y. My model 3 is being shipped in another month. I am also happy to buy an American car again. I would be willing to buy another Toyota since it served me so well. I wanted to try an electric and the cost savings for local driving is incredibly desirable. Being able to charge your car without having to go to a gas station is also cool.
我擁有的最后一輛傳統(tǒng)美國品牌汽車是福特 EXP。這輛車外觀漂亮，開幾年都很好，但有一次它開始出現(xiàn)電氣問題，讓我陷入困境，根本無法啟動，直到它突然決定重新啟動。這極大地打消了我購買美國汽車的念頭。我接下來的 6 輛車都是豐田車，每輛車都使用良好，開了 10 年，然后賣掉了它們，這樣我就可以再次購買一輛新車。最近我買了兩輛特斯拉汽車。Model Y 在前 5 個月的表現(xiàn)非常好。我的 Model 3 將在下個月發(fā)貨。我也很高興再次購買美國車。我愿意再買一輛豐田，因為它對我而言非常好用。我想試試電動車，而且在當(dāng)?shù)伛{駛時節(jié)省的費用非常誘人。不用去加油站就能給車充電也很酷。
Stellantis has already hit the iceberg. They're rearranging the proverbial deck chairs as the orchestra warms up.
斯特蘭蒂斯已經(jīng)撞上了冰山。隨著樂隊的熱身，他們正在重新安排甲板上的椅子。
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If you were in Telecommunication industry, you will find out what happened in the last 25 years, and the Automotive industry WILL follow the same way :)
如果你從事電信行業(yè)，你就會發(fā)現(xiàn)過去 25 年發(fā)生了什么，汽車行業(yè)也將走上同樣的道路
Who would have thunk that $100k ICE pickup trucks would not sell?
誰會想到售價 10 萬美元的 ICE 皮卡賣不出去？
What I find interesting is US auto dealerships are complaining about declining sales, but their owners are making money. The auto manufacturers may follow the Cummins and Pepsi mold and purchase all their US distributorships. Not only will the manufacturers make more money by cutting overhead, but they will also be closer to their end customers.
我覺得有趣的是，美國汽車經(jīng)銷商抱怨銷量下滑，但他們的老板卻在賺錢。汽車制造商可能會效仿康明斯和百事可樂，收購它們在美國的所有經(jīng)銷權(quán)。通過削減管理費用，制造商不僅能賺取更多利潤，而且也能更接近最終客戶。
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Peugeot and Jeep brands are entered Thailand officially. (I am not sure about the other Stellantises.) They are in premium segments, due to expensive prices. Very low sales there.
標(biāo)致和吉普品牌正式進入泰國。（我不確定其他斯特蘭提斯品牌的情況。）由于價格昂貴，它們屬于高端市場。那里的銷量很低。
I have a Volvo EX30. What a crap. Bugs all over the places
Yesterday I was charging I could not open my car to remove the plug it took 4 mn.
The screen did freeze several times. Terrible quality.
I’ve read that many people just gave their car back to the dealer. I understand these guys
我有一輛沃爾沃 EX30。真是糟糕。到處都是毛病。
昨天我在充電時無法打開車子拔掉插頭，花了 有4 分鐘。
屏幕確實凍結(jié)了好幾次。質(zhì)量太差了。
我看到過很多人把車還給了經(jīng)銷商。我理解這些人
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That's not correct, Stellantis is centralizing their production. The Italian State is not happy about it because currently Stellantis is not giving the italian production sites a priority. So, multiple production sites in italy are not in use. The state was threatening Stellatis to inappropriate 2 historic car brands (Innocenti, Autobianchi) and offer the brands to cinese manufacturer if they agree to produce the cars in italy.
這不是真的，斯特蘭提斯正在集中生產(chǎn)。意大利政府對此并不高興，因為 斯特蘭提斯目前沒有優(yōu)先考慮意大利生產(chǎn)基地。因此，意大利的多個生產(chǎn)基地沒有投入使用。意大利政府威脅斯特蘭提斯將侵占兩個歷史悠久的汽車品牌（Innocenti 和 Autobianchi），如果中國制造商同意在意大利生產(chǎn)這些汽車，那么他們將把這兩個品牌提供給中國制造商。
What's that neon green car at the beginning? I want me one!
開頭那輛霓虹綠色的車是什么？我想要一輛！
Dodge and Jeep have been sold many times, nobody could make money with the two brands.
道奇和吉普已經(jīng)被出售多次，沒有人能靠這兩個品牌賺錢。
Chrysler and Dodge ruined their lineups. They discontinued everything they made between then except the Pacifica minivan and Durango SUV with no replacements ready, or realistically in sight.
克萊斯勒和道奇毀掉了自己的產(chǎn)品線。他們停產(chǎn)了自那時起生產(chǎn)的所有車型，只留下 Pacifica 小型貨車和 Durango SUV，而且沒有現(xiàn)成的替代車型，或者說，目前還看不到替代車型的跡象。
these brands all needed a massive injection of funds when stellantis was born. They were corporatised and now are dead in the EV age. As you say SAM, the lies are there to prop up the share price, to keep the music going.
這些品牌在斯特蘭提斯 誕生時都需要大量資金注入。它們被公司化了，現(xiàn)在在電動汽車時代已經(jīng)消亡了。正如你所說，謊言的存在是為了支撐股價，接著奏樂接著舞。
The Chinese are only interested in the name, so it makes sense to buy Maserati. Also they can sell more expensive cars with higher margin, because of the name. Very clever.
中國人只對名字感興趣，所以購買瑪莎拉蒂是合理的。而且，有了瑪莎拉蒂，他們就能以更高的利潤率銷售更昂貴的汽車。非常聰明。
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Would I be too pessimistic if I said that none of the North American automakers have a reasonable chance of making an affordable EV because they are not vertically integrated which will limit production efficiency. The North American do not have the ability to manufacture an EV battery to compete with the batteries now produced by CATL or BYD. I doubt if they ever will...
如果我說北美汽車制造商都沒有合理的機會制造出價格實惠的電動汽車，因為他們沒有垂直整合，這將限制生產(chǎn)效率，那么我是否太悲觀了？北美沒有能力生產(chǎn)電動汽車電池來與 CATL 或比亞迪目前生產(chǎn)的電池競爭。我懷疑他們是否能做到……
The problem stelantis has is that every make is competing in the same segment. Which is the Daca competitor, alpha and ds should be against audio (that is a laugh) fiat is probably different if it stays to being specialised in small/supermini cars.
The rest are fighting against each other
斯特蘭提斯的問題是每個品牌都在同一細分市場競爭。Daca 的競爭對手是 alpha 和 ds，他們應(yīng)該針對音響（真是可笑），如果 fiat 繼續(xù)專注于小型/超小型車，情況可能會有所不同。
其余的都在互相競爭
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Tesla needs a challenger in the US
特斯拉在美國需要一個挑戰(zhàn)者
In addition to Maserati, Alfa is a luxury brand. Chrysler Peugeot and Citroen used to compete for luxury but not recently. The highest price Jeeps are de-facto luxury vehicles but it is not a luxury brand.
除了瑪莎拉蒂，阿爾法羅密歐也是豪華品牌?？巳R斯勒標(biāo)致和雪鐵龍曾經(jīng)在豪華車領(lǐng)域競爭，但最近卻沒有。價格最高的吉普車是事實上的豪華車，但它不是豪華品牌。
Stellantis is cooked, their production lines are old and expensive to run making unaffordable cars.
斯特蘭提斯已經(jīng)完蛋了，他們的生產(chǎn)線老舊而且運行成本高昂，生產(chǎn)的汽車讓人買不起。
people in us have been waiting along time first evs like charger, of course gm still has not come out with blazer ev ss. they keeps dragiing there feet and will bite them in the butt
我們這些人已經(jīng)等待 Charger 這樣的首款電動汽車很長時間了，當(dāng)然，通用汽車還沒有推出 Blazer EV SSS。他們一直在拖延，最終會自食其果
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Funny how Tesla profits collapse by 50% but you don't consider that to be a crisis.
有趣的是，特斯拉的利潤下降了 50%，但你卻不認(rèn)為這是一場危機。
Realistically, if you exclude regulatory credits, Stellantis did better in their latest financial reporting than Tesla. Tesla's net profit for the quarter when excluding regulatory credits was down over 75% YoY. Most of Tesla's net income last quarter was regulatory credits. As Tesla sales are down, they likely pulled some of those credit sales forward to inflate quarterly numbers. Subsidies made them profitable, and Tesla is far more vulnerable to political shifts than Stellantis. Neither one is growing, but Stelantis has a forward P/E ratio of around 3, while Tesla is around 100. In other words, for the each dollar of profit they make this year, you have to pay ~33 times more for Tesla shares.
實際上，如果排除監(jiān)管信貸，斯特蘭提斯在最新財務(wù)報告中的表現(xiàn)要好于特斯拉。特斯拉本季度的凈利潤在排除監(jiān)管信貸后同比下降了 75% 以上。特斯拉上季度的凈收入大部分來自監(jiān)管信貸。由于特斯拉銷量下降，他們可能會提前部分信貸銷售以虛增季度數(shù)據(jù)。補貼使它們盈利，特斯拉比斯特蘭提斯更容易受到政治變化的影響。這兩家公司都沒有增長，但斯特蘭提斯的預(yù)期市盈率約為 3，而特斯拉約為 100。換句話說，他們今年每賺一美元，你就得為特斯拉的股票支付約 33 倍的價格。
What do car companies really own? Factories and machines. An available workforce that can operate the machines, near the factories. A design 'language' that has a proven market ( 'Intellectual Property' ).
Many foreign companies compete unfairly because their countries have little or no standards for pay, safety or pollution. And plentiful corruption!
I don't want to live that way - and I bet you don't either. We should not allow them to be imported.
汽車公司真正擁有的是什么？工廠和機器。工廠附近有一批可以操作機器的勞動力。一種具有成熟市場的設(shè)計“語言”（“知識產(chǎn)權(quán)”）。
許多外國公司進行不公平競爭，因為他們的國家?guī)缀鯖]有或根本沒有薪酬、安全或污染標(biāo)準(zhǔn)。而且腐敗現(xiàn)象猖獗！
我不想過這樣的生活——我敢打賭你也不想。我們不應(yīng)該允許它們進口。
They have way too many brands, their brands are competing with each other not with the other groups or Chinese cars! No competitive advantage except very small cars in very low price points in ICE vehicles. Their electric offerings will be in trouble as soon as Tesla have a smaller model and BYD starts production in Europe. They are already hopeless in other markets.
他們有太多品牌，他們的品牌之間相互競爭，而不是與其他集團或中國汽車競爭！除了內(nèi)燃機汽車中價格非常低廉的小型車外，沒有任何競爭優(yōu)勢。一旦特斯拉推出小型車型，比亞迪開始在歐洲生產(chǎn)，他們的電動車產(chǎn)品就會陷入困境。他們在其他市場已經(jīng)絕望了。
Alfa Romeo and Maserati are known for bad electrical components. The wiring harnesses are just of to thin wire and their computer management systems (ECU) software is probable bad written. This is known for decades.
Stellantis has to much brands. Let them sell the American brands like Chrysler. Sell brands or build them outside US and EU. Just supervise the whole process better. Then quality and compete effectively prices are coming back.
Selling to the Chinese is heading to go bankrupt due to a huge competition.
阿爾法羅密歐和瑪莎拉蒂的電氣元件質(zhì)量很差。線束由太細的電線組成，而且它們的計算機管理系統(tǒng) (ECU) 軟件可能編寫得很差。幾十年來，人們都知道這一點。
斯特蘭提斯的品牌太多了。讓他們賣掉克萊斯勒這樣的美國品牌吧。在美國和歐盟以外銷售或生產(chǎn)品牌。只需更好地監(jiān)督整個過程。然后質(zhì)量和有效競爭價格就會回升。
由于競爭激烈，賣給中國人就要破產(chǎn)了。
Sam, you should embrace any EV as it is better for the environment in the long run. To get over the crisis, your company, BYD, had pivoted to hybrids, which is less effective. What is better, a Stalantis EV or a BYD hybrid?
薩姆，你應(yīng)該接受任何電動汽車，因為從長遠來看，它對環(huán)境更有利。為了度過危機，你（喜歡）的公司比亞迪轉(zhuǎn)向了混合動力車，但效果不太好。斯特蘭提斯電動汽車和比亞迪混合動力汽車哪個更好？
Hedge Fund Group Stellantis did this to themselves -- I love it. Greed never ends well. It's very sad they've destroyed marquee named auto brands. But It's also to be expected when these companies try to run ANYTHING. If a hedge fund is running something -- you best believe it is going to be bean counted into the ground. JEEP is NOT a luxury brand -- so why is the freaking Wranger sold for upwards of 50K? That is insane. The prices for the Grand Cherokee -- outrageous. And no one needs a 115K Wagoneer! They've dug their grave -- now it's a matter of time before they are buried.
對沖基金集團斯特蘭提斯就是這么做的——我很喜歡。貪婪沒有好下場。他們毀掉了知名汽車品牌，這很可悲。但當(dāng)這些公司試圖經(jīng)營任何事情時，這也是意料之中的。如果對沖基金正在經(jīng)營某件事——你最好相信它會被徹底摧毀。JEEP 不是奢侈品牌——那么為什么 Wranger 的售價高達 5萬美元？這太瘋狂了。大切諾基的價格太離譜了。而且沒人需要 11.5萬美元的 Wagoneer！他們已經(jīng)挖好了墳?zāi)埂裨崴麄冎皇菚r間問題。
Italians might be too proud to part with Maserati or any real italian brands but Jeep has a deep imprint in China being one of the oldest nameplates, and the first foreign one (along with VW) there. So it would make most sense for Chinese to buy jeep if the price is right, but of course no price is right with a dying brand with lousy product lines and even lousier UAW contract.
意大利人可能過于驕傲，不愿放棄瑪莎拉蒂或任何真正的意大利品牌，但吉普在中國卻有著很深的印記，它是最古老的品牌之一，也是第一個進入中國的外國品牌（與大眾一起）。因此，如果價格合適的話，中國人購買吉普車是最明智的選擇，但對于一個產(chǎn)品線糟糕、UAW合同更差、瀕臨消亡的品牌來說，無論什么價格都是不合適的。
RIP Stellantis
安息吧，斯特蘭蒂斯
BYD should buy them and save the company and also enter the USA and European market because they are the best. Buffet is a smart guy ...he bought BYD long time ago.
比亞迪應(yīng)該收購它們，拯救該公司，并進入美國和歐洲市場，因為它們是最好的。巴菲特是個聰明人……他很久以前就投資了比亞迪。
Not surprising if it goes through. The Chinese have done a great job with Volvo, MG and Lotus.
如果成功的話，一點也不奇怪。中國人在收購和經(jīng)營沃爾沃、MG 和 蓮花等品牌方面表現(xiàn)非常出色。
BYD will do to Chrysler what Geely did to Volvo.
比亞迪將對克萊斯勒所做的，一如吉利對沃爾沃的做法。